Recruiter wants very extensive technical details about all of my previous work












117















I was recently cold-called by a recruiter on LinkedIn who had seen my profile/resume. The position seemed to be a very good fit for my skill set so I replied that I was very interested. Within minutes we were talking on the phone and after a laundry list of generic technical screening questions, we move on to discuss my personal projects. The recruiter responds positively but keeps asking for deeper and deeper details, to the point that I'm basically reading him pseudo-code. He does the same with my work projects but I (somewhat clumsily) deflect implementation level questions because the code isn't my property to share.



Seemingly unsatisfied, he requests that I send him an expanded version of my resume including "every technical detail you can think of" about every relevant project I've worked on all the way back through my senior year of college (about 4 years of work). He mentioned how a similarly experienced developer had submitted 20 pages of such information and was asked for more. This is apparently an application requirement set by the position's manager. I said that it sounded like a lot of work but could get it to him sometime the next week.



After some time to process such a whirlwind, I think this is way beyond asking for examples of my skills/experience to evaluate my candidacy. Is this recruiter/manager trying to steal the fruits of my labor or am I just paranoid?



Update: I walked away from the situation. The answers brought up a lot of possibilities, none of which I want to be involved with. I'm going to ignore cold-calls in the future.










share|improve this question




















  • 1





    Regarding sharing your current companies code: workplace.stackexchange.com/questions/69744/…

    – Gregory Currie
    Mar 15 at 11:45






  • 1





    Does the "recruiter" have a website and a company that you can research? There are a lot of "spam" recruiting companies out there... it's not uncommon to get a deluge of requests for a reasonably experience resume. (or can you name the company here?)

    – WernerCD
    Mar 15 at 15:46
















117















I was recently cold-called by a recruiter on LinkedIn who had seen my profile/resume. The position seemed to be a very good fit for my skill set so I replied that I was very interested. Within minutes we were talking on the phone and after a laundry list of generic technical screening questions, we move on to discuss my personal projects. The recruiter responds positively but keeps asking for deeper and deeper details, to the point that I'm basically reading him pseudo-code. He does the same with my work projects but I (somewhat clumsily) deflect implementation level questions because the code isn't my property to share.



Seemingly unsatisfied, he requests that I send him an expanded version of my resume including "every technical detail you can think of" about every relevant project I've worked on all the way back through my senior year of college (about 4 years of work). He mentioned how a similarly experienced developer had submitted 20 pages of such information and was asked for more. This is apparently an application requirement set by the position's manager. I said that it sounded like a lot of work but could get it to him sometime the next week.



After some time to process such a whirlwind, I think this is way beyond asking for examples of my skills/experience to evaluate my candidacy. Is this recruiter/manager trying to steal the fruits of my labor or am I just paranoid?



Update: I walked away from the situation. The answers brought up a lot of possibilities, none of which I want to be involved with. I'm going to ignore cold-calls in the future.










share|improve this question




















  • 1





    Regarding sharing your current companies code: workplace.stackexchange.com/questions/69744/…

    – Gregory Currie
    Mar 15 at 11:45






  • 1





    Does the "recruiter" have a website and a company that you can research? There are a lot of "spam" recruiting companies out there... it's not uncommon to get a deluge of requests for a reasonably experience resume. (or can you name the company here?)

    – WernerCD
    Mar 15 at 15:46














117












117








117


5






I was recently cold-called by a recruiter on LinkedIn who had seen my profile/resume. The position seemed to be a very good fit for my skill set so I replied that I was very interested. Within minutes we were talking on the phone and after a laundry list of generic technical screening questions, we move on to discuss my personal projects. The recruiter responds positively but keeps asking for deeper and deeper details, to the point that I'm basically reading him pseudo-code. He does the same with my work projects but I (somewhat clumsily) deflect implementation level questions because the code isn't my property to share.



Seemingly unsatisfied, he requests that I send him an expanded version of my resume including "every technical detail you can think of" about every relevant project I've worked on all the way back through my senior year of college (about 4 years of work). He mentioned how a similarly experienced developer had submitted 20 pages of such information and was asked for more. This is apparently an application requirement set by the position's manager. I said that it sounded like a lot of work but could get it to him sometime the next week.



After some time to process such a whirlwind, I think this is way beyond asking for examples of my skills/experience to evaluate my candidacy. Is this recruiter/manager trying to steal the fruits of my labor or am I just paranoid?



Update: I walked away from the situation. The answers brought up a lot of possibilities, none of which I want to be involved with. I'm going to ignore cold-calls in the future.










share|improve this question
















I was recently cold-called by a recruiter on LinkedIn who had seen my profile/resume. The position seemed to be a very good fit for my skill set so I replied that I was very interested. Within minutes we were talking on the phone and after a laundry list of generic technical screening questions, we move on to discuss my personal projects. The recruiter responds positively but keeps asking for deeper and deeper details, to the point that I'm basically reading him pseudo-code. He does the same with my work projects but I (somewhat clumsily) deflect implementation level questions because the code isn't my property to share.



Seemingly unsatisfied, he requests that I send him an expanded version of my resume including "every technical detail you can think of" about every relevant project I've worked on all the way back through my senior year of college (about 4 years of work). He mentioned how a similarly experienced developer had submitted 20 pages of such information and was asked for more. This is apparently an application requirement set by the position's manager. I said that it sounded like a lot of work but could get it to him sometime the next week.



After some time to process such a whirlwind, I think this is way beyond asking for examples of my skills/experience to evaluate my candidacy. Is this recruiter/manager trying to steal the fruits of my labor or am I just paranoid?



Update: I walked away from the situation. The answers brought up a lot of possibilities, none of which I want to be involved with. I'm going to ignore cold-calls in the future.







resume job-search recruitment






share|improve this question















share|improve this question













share|improve this question




share|improve this question








edited Mar 15 at 20:10







sm9sn1

















asked Mar 15 at 9:56









sm9sn1sm9sn1

663228




663228








  • 1





    Regarding sharing your current companies code: workplace.stackexchange.com/questions/69744/…

    – Gregory Currie
    Mar 15 at 11:45






  • 1





    Does the "recruiter" have a website and a company that you can research? There are a lot of "spam" recruiting companies out there... it's not uncommon to get a deluge of requests for a reasonably experience resume. (or can you name the company here?)

    – WernerCD
    Mar 15 at 15:46














  • 1





    Regarding sharing your current companies code: workplace.stackexchange.com/questions/69744/…

    – Gregory Currie
    Mar 15 at 11:45






  • 1





    Does the "recruiter" have a website and a company that you can research? There are a lot of "spam" recruiting companies out there... it's not uncommon to get a deluge of requests for a reasonably experience resume. (or can you name the company here?)

    – WernerCD
    Mar 15 at 15:46








1




1





Regarding sharing your current companies code: workplace.stackexchange.com/questions/69744/…

– Gregory Currie
Mar 15 at 11:45





Regarding sharing your current companies code: workplace.stackexchange.com/questions/69744/…

– Gregory Currie
Mar 15 at 11:45




1




1





Does the "recruiter" have a website and a company that you can research? There are a lot of "spam" recruiting companies out there... it's not uncommon to get a deluge of requests for a reasonably experience resume. (or can you name the company here?)

– WernerCD
Mar 15 at 15:46





Does the "recruiter" have a website and a company that you can research? There are a lot of "spam" recruiting companies out there... it's not uncommon to get a deluge of requests for a reasonably experience resume. (or can you name the company here?)

– WernerCD
Mar 15 at 15:46










7 Answers
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177














No, this is an unacceptable level of detail.



No experienced (and self-respecting) developer would put up with this. And to be honest, no real recruiter would want this level of detail. It is just too much data to go through.



You must push back, as you have been, with questions around implementation details, or even features, on projects that you worked on while you've been employed elsewhere.



I have no idea if they are trying to steal your code, or what the deal is, but their motivations don't matter.



If possible, you should make available some of your work on something like Github. Obviously, it must be work you own so they can take a look at the actual code.



Keep in mind, if this IS an actual recruiter and it is on request of the position's manager, this may not reflect well on the organisation in question.






share|improve this answer





















  • 132





    I've yet to meet a recruiter that could understand that level of detail.

    – Peter M
    Mar 15 at 13:38






  • 22





    @PeterM True. However, to make it real, they included a manager also in the story. :)

    – Sourav Ghosh
    Mar 15 at 13:39






  • 5





    Now you're just making me laugh.

    – Peter M
    Mar 15 at 13:40






  • 12





    @PeterM I know a few senior programmers who became recruiters. They would understand that level of details, but I don't see any of them asking for it. They all know how to use GitHub.

    – Abigail
    Mar 15 at 16:07






  • 1





    There is also intellectual property and other stuff that you cannot disclose from your current employer and maybe other recent employers. Sometimes, even highly descriptions violate that contract you signed when you were hired.

    – Thomas Matthews
    Mar 16 at 21:05



















94















Is this recruiter/manager trying to steal the fruits of my labor or am I just paranoid?




None, this looks like a scam.



Under no circumstances, you are supposed to give away the exact minute details of the working project for your current employer, let alone the source code and/or documentation. That would be a serious violation of the contract in most of the countries and most likely you can end up facing criminal charges. No reasonable employer would even ask this of you (or any applicant).



If they are willing to check "your skills" thoroughly, they can ask and arrange for an on-line or in-person coding test, there is nothing in your existing code that proves your skills. Heck, you might even showcase code written by someone else as yours, so there's nothing that can be proved by either sharing or receiving the code for your current employer.



Stop communicating. Run fast and run away from this.






share|improve this answer





















  • 51





    Instead of a scam it could also be social engineering based pen test. In either case the winning move is not to play.

    – Peter M
    Mar 15 at 13:37











  • @PeterM That's why I said "looks like". And I agree to the last sentence.

    – Sourav Ghosh
    Mar 15 at 13:38






  • 2





    @ESR Don't know...maybe get to know the product architecture to find vulnerabilities? Maybe find out the architecture of a particular module? Maybe gain knowledge about a patented-part? It could be anything, but real interview. :)

    – Sourav Ghosh
    Mar 15 at 13:59






  • 7





    @ESR Not so much a scammer as a hacker. The first step of any hack is learning the technical details of the system you are targeting. The more you know about the system you are attacking, the more you can narrow down what kinds of vulnerabilities you need to exploit, and what kinds of protections are in place that you need to account for.

    – Nosajimiki
    Mar 15 at 14:26






  • 4





    I can think of a possible scam -- wanting to emulate this person's work history for immigration reasons?

    – Yakk
    Mar 15 at 17:14



















54














If you currently work for a government contractor, report this to your security group



This sounds like attempted industrial espionage and/or traditional espionage. If you work or have worked in any way for the government, directly or indirectly, report this to your security rep immediately.



Otherwise, run away as fast as you can



You could get into legal hot water by participating in what appears to be industrial espionage. Run away! If you have concerns that you may have already crossed legal boundaries by violating IP law or NDAs, contact a lawyer.






share|improve this answer





















  • 2





    Yes, even if you worked for the government in the past. Or maybe even something on your profile that is typically government like intern at NASA or some research or grant in college that was eventually sold to the government.

    – Dan
    Mar 15 at 16:36








  • 2





    Updated based on your comment--thanks @Dan.

    – bob
    Mar 15 at 16:40











  • If you've left govt contracting and don't have a dod security rep at your current job, appropriate people to report a possible espionage attempt would be your old jobs security officer, a security officer at another contractor/govt office, or the FBI.

    – Dan Neely
    Mar 18 at 13:35



















16















He mentioned how a similarly experienced developer had submitted 20 pages of such information and was asked for more. This is apparently an application requirement set by the position's manager. I said that it sounded like a lot of work but could get it to him sometime the next week.




This might sound crazy but I wouldn't be surprised if the guy was some sort of state ran operative. It sounds like he's soliciting people with certain profiles to determine things. A 20 page technical detail sounds insane. Would you give 20 pages detailing everything you did to a stranger on a street just because they said they work as a recruiter for some company? Why would you trust a person on the internet asking for the same thing as someone would as a stranger on the streets?



I wouldn't even reply. Just delete and continue on.






share|improve this answer



















  • 7





    That's not crazy at all. However, the level of "attention" paid to one person indicates this is a very targeted activity. It could full well be part of a security audit.

    – Wesley Long
    Mar 15 at 14:58






  • 1





    @WesleyLong Yeah my guess is a keyword on his resume matches something. So he wants a technical detail to disguise what he's really asking. He already clued in that he'd ask for more even with a 20 page so he's likely to return with, "This is great, but tell me more about <insert what he really wants to know>? You're not very clear on X, Y, and Z of that part."

    – Dan
    Mar 15 at 16:46



















9














I would strongly recommend that you inform your previous employers about this recruiter, because this is most likely an attempt at company espionage. Technical details like this are none of his business. If he says that someone submitted 20 pages of such documentation, then the recruiter is frankly lying. And I have never, ever encountered a prospective employer who was interested in that kind of information - actually, most wouldn’t want to know that kind of thing because of fear of legal consequences.






share|improve this answer
























  • This. This is my suspicion, too. This level of technical detail is very uncommon on the field, even for some rare, seldom used techs.

    – T. Sar
    Mar 17 at 18:12



















4














I'm from an Engineering background, but it would definitely raise a few flags for me. The only way I would even consider showing anything is in a personal meeting, printed on paper, and take it back when I leave.



Don't send anything, as you might be delivering company secrets to a competitor. Disclosing any sensitive information should be done only after getting an NDA signed.



I would question any additional request from this so-called recruiter.






share|improve this answer





















  • 8





    You would have absolutely no rights to share any code, even upon acquiring a NDA. And NDAs cover sharing information with 3rd parties. The recruiter may be the competitor themselves! NDAs are also signed by those receiving the privileged information, not the one sending. Signing a NDA, then handing over privileged information to someone else doesn't make sense on an almost comical level.

    – Gregory Currie
    Mar 15 at 10:14






  • 6





    I think maybe I'm not explaining myself either. If person X, works for company Y, and recruiter Z is to meet with person X. For any NDA to have an effect, it must be between company Y and recruiter Z. The intellectual property belongs to company Y. Disclosing the IP is likely a breach of X's employee contract, regardless of whatever contractual conditions person X reaches with recruiter Z.

    – Gregory Currie
    Mar 15 at 10:27






  • 1





    It really depends what the employee contract states. As an aside, even discussing a patent can reveal information not in the patent. You also state that "Disclosing any sensitive information should be done only after getting an NDA signed." which I understand to mean... well... what it says. In addition, you say you are printing out "something like that", I'm not sure exactly what "that" means, can be several things. I'm not trying to analyse your answer to death, but it includes advice that allows the OP to be fired immediately.

    – Gregory Currie
    Mar 15 at 10:39








  • 2





    It's actually trivially easy to not talk about the specifics of work, and to be honest, most employees will not ask such questions. It's even easier to not share code belonging to your current employer and present it to a third party. In a lot of places doing so is instant dismissal. Giving the false sense that an NDA will somehow protect the employee is really dangerous to reader, and you should really consider rewording your answer.

    – Gregory Currie
    Mar 15 at 11:40






  • 2





    Disclosing any confidential information about your current or previous employer should happen NOT AT ALL. NEVER.

    – gnasher729
    Mar 15 at 21:07



















2














As best as I can guess, one of two things is happening here, neither of which is good:



1) The company is asking you for reams and reams of data just because they can. They want to see if you'll do it, knowing full well that no real hiring manager will actually read the entire body of your corpus (plus, it's code not prose, so it's much more difficult to read). They're putting you through the paces to see how well you acclimatize to ridiculous requests. This means that you can be expected, on the job, to field such ridiculous requests and expected to do them. This is not good.



2) The company has such few applicants that the hiring manager has the spare time to read reams and reams of code from applicants to determine the good ones. This is a job nobody wants, and for good reason (because they ask for your entire corpus of everything you've ever done!). If nobody else wants to be associated with this company, why should you? Furthermore, it also speaks to the level of micromanagement in the company, where the hiring manager wants to read every line of code you're ever going to write, and has nothing better to do with their time than critique every member of their team personally and individually on a line-by-line basis. Run away from this type of micromanagement.



In any case, submit what you think is reasonable. Do not submit any code you have written for any employer, that's almost certainly very illegal. Take like 15 minutes of your time and put together a set of projects you have completed that you would feel comfortable submitting and ship it to them as a portfolio. If that's not enough for them, then simply say "sorry, that's all I have for you, if that's not enough then I think we're done here".



For future, you might want to consider hosting your personal projects on GitHub so that anyone can easily peruse your portfolio at their leisure rather than putting in this much work. It's near-zero work for you to put together a GitHub account, and then you don't have to go through this. Simply say "Look at my GitHub" and be done with it.






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    7 Answers
    7






    active

    oldest

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    7 Answers
    7






    active

    oldest

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    active

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    177














    No, this is an unacceptable level of detail.



    No experienced (and self-respecting) developer would put up with this. And to be honest, no real recruiter would want this level of detail. It is just too much data to go through.



    You must push back, as you have been, with questions around implementation details, or even features, on projects that you worked on while you've been employed elsewhere.



    I have no idea if they are trying to steal your code, or what the deal is, but their motivations don't matter.



    If possible, you should make available some of your work on something like Github. Obviously, it must be work you own so they can take a look at the actual code.



    Keep in mind, if this IS an actual recruiter and it is on request of the position's manager, this may not reflect well on the organisation in question.






    share|improve this answer





















    • 132





      I've yet to meet a recruiter that could understand that level of detail.

      – Peter M
      Mar 15 at 13:38






    • 22





      @PeterM True. However, to make it real, they included a manager also in the story. :)

      – Sourav Ghosh
      Mar 15 at 13:39






    • 5





      Now you're just making me laugh.

      – Peter M
      Mar 15 at 13:40






    • 12





      @PeterM I know a few senior programmers who became recruiters. They would understand that level of details, but I don't see any of them asking for it. They all know how to use GitHub.

      – Abigail
      Mar 15 at 16:07






    • 1





      There is also intellectual property and other stuff that you cannot disclose from your current employer and maybe other recent employers. Sometimes, even highly descriptions violate that contract you signed when you were hired.

      – Thomas Matthews
      Mar 16 at 21:05
















    177














    No, this is an unacceptable level of detail.



    No experienced (and self-respecting) developer would put up with this. And to be honest, no real recruiter would want this level of detail. It is just too much data to go through.



    You must push back, as you have been, with questions around implementation details, or even features, on projects that you worked on while you've been employed elsewhere.



    I have no idea if they are trying to steal your code, or what the deal is, but their motivations don't matter.



    If possible, you should make available some of your work on something like Github. Obviously, it must be work you own so they can take a look at the actual code.



    Keep in mind, if this IS an actual recruiter and it is on request of the position's manager, this may not reflect well on the organisation in question.






    share|improve this answer





















    • 132





      I've yet to meet a recruiter that could understand that level of detail.

      – Peter M
      Mar 15 at 13:38






    • 22





      @PeterM True. However, to make it real, they included a manager also in the story. :)

      – Sourav Ghosh
      Mar 15 at 13:39






    • 5





      Now you're just making me laugh.

      – Peter M
      Mar 15 at 13:40






    • 12





      @PeterM I know a few senior programmers who became recruiters. They would understand that level of details, but I don't see any of them asking for it. They all know how to use GitHub.

      – Abigail
      Mar 15 at 16:07






    • 1





      There is also intellectual property and other stuff that you cannot disclose from your current employer and maybe other recent employers. Sometimes, even highly descriptions violate that contract you signed when you were hired.

      – Thomas Matthews
      Mar 16 at 21:05














    177












    177








    177







    No, this is an unacceptable level of detail.



    No experienced (and self-respecting) developer would put up with this. And to be honest, no real recruiter would want this level of detail. It is just too much data to go through.



    You must push back, as you have been, with questions around implementation details, or even features, on projects that you worked on while you've been employed elsewhere.



    I have no idea if they are trying to steal your code, or what the deal is, but their motivations don't matter.



    If possible, you should make available some of your work on something like Github. Obviously, it must be work you own so they can take a look at the actual code.



    Keep in mind, if this IS an actual recruiter and it is on request of the position's manager, this may not reflect well on the organisation in question.






    share|improve this answer















    No, this is an unacceptable level of detail.



    No experienced (and self-respecting) developer would put up with this. And to be honest, no real recruiter would want this level of detail. It is just too much data to go through.



    You must push back, as you have been, with questions around implementation details, or even features, on projects that you worked on while you've been employed elsewhere.



    I have no idea if they are trying to steal your code, or what the deal is, but their motivations don't matter.



    If possible, you should make available some of your work on something like Github. Obviously, it must be work you own so they can take a look at the actual code.



    Keep in mind, if this IS an actual recruiter and it is on request of the position's manager, this may not reflect well on the organisation in question.







    share|improve this answer














    share|improve this answer



    share|improve this answer








    edited Mar 18 at 11:32

























    answered Mar 15 at 10:03









    Gregory CurrieGregory Currie

    3,69072033




    3,69072033








    • 132





      I've yet to meet a recruiter that could understand that level of detail.

      – Peter M
      Mar 15 at 13:38






    • 22





      @PeterM True. However, to make it real, they included a manager also in the story. :)

      – Sourav Ghosh
      Mar 15 at 13:39






    • 5





      Now you're just making me laugh.

      – Peter M
      Mar 15 at 13:40






    • 12





      @PeterM I know a few senior programmers who became recruiters. They would understand that level of details, but I don't see any of them asking for it. They all know how to use GitHub.

      – Abigail
      Mar 15 at 16:07






    • 1





      There is also intellectual property and other stuff that you cannot disclose from your current employer and maybe other recent employers. Sometimes, even highly descriptions violate that contract you signed when you were hired.

      – Thomas Matthews
      Mar 16 at 21:05














    • 132





      I've yet to meet a recruiter that could understand that level of detail.

      – Peter M
      Mar 15 at 13:38






    • 22





      @PeterM True. However, to make it real, they included a manager also in the story. :)

      – Sourav Ghosh
      Mar 15 at 13:39






    • 5





      Now you're just making me laugh.

      – Peter M
      Mar 15 at 13:40






    • 12





      @PeterM I know a few senior programmers who became recruiters. They would understand that level of details, but I don't see any of them asking for it. They all know how to use GitHub.

      – Abigail
      Mar 15 at 16:07






    • 1





      There is also intellectual property and other stuff that you cannot disclose from your current employer and maybe other recent employers. Sometimes, even highly descriptions violate that contract you signed when you were hired.

      – Thomas Matthews
      Mar 16 at 21:05








    132




    132





    I've yet to meet a recruiter that could understand that level of detail.

    – Peter M
    Mar 15 at 13:38





    I've yet to meet a recruiter that could understand that level of detail.

    – Peter M
    Mar 15 at 13:38




    22




    22





    @PeterM True. However, to make it real, they included a manager also in the story. :)

    – Sourav Ghosh
    Mar 15 at 13:39





    @PeterM True. However, to make it real, they included a manager also in the story. :)

    – Sourav Ghosh
    Mar 15 at 13:39




    5




    5





    Now you're just making me laugh.

    – Peter M
    Mar 15 at 13:40





    Now you're just making me laugh.

    – Peter M
    Mar 15 at 13:40




    12




    12





    @PeterM I know a few senior programmers who became recruiters. They would understand that level of details, but I don't see any of them asking for it. They all know how to use GitHub.

    – Abigail
    Mar 15 at 16:07





    @PeterM I know a few senior programmers who became recruiters. They would understand that level of details, but I don't see any of them asking for it. They all know how to use GitHub.

    – Abigail
    Mar 15 at 16:07




    1




    1





    There is also intellectual property and other stuff that you cannot disclose from your current employer and maybe other recent employers. Sometimes, even highly descriptions violate that contract you signed when you were hired.

    – Thomas Matthews
    Mar 16 at 21:05





    There is also intellectual property and other stuff that you cannot disclose from your current employer and maybe other recent employers. Sometimes, even highly descriptions violate that contract you signed when you were hired.

    – Thomas Matthews
    Mar 16 at 21:05













    94















    Is this recruiter/manager trying to steal the fruits of my labor or am I just paranoid?




    None, this looks like a scam.



    Under no circumstances, you are supposed to give away the exact minute details of the working project for your current employer, let alone the source code and/or documentation. That would be a serious violation of the contract in most of the countries and most likely you can end up facing criminal charges. No reasonable employer would even ask this of you (or any applicant).



    If they are willing to check "your skills" thoroughly, they can ask and arrange for an on-line or in-person coding test, there is nothing in your existing code that proves your skills. Heck, you might even showcase code written by someone else as yours, so there's nothing that can be proved by either sharing or receiving the code for your current employer.



    Stop communicating. Run fast and run away from this.






    share|improve this answer





















    • 51





      Instead of a scam it could also be social engineering based pen test. In either case the winning move is not to play.

      – Peter M
      Mar 15 at 13:37











    • @PeterM That's why I said "looks like". And I agree to the last sentence.

      – Sourav Ghosh
      Mar 15 at 13:38






    • 2





      @ESR Don't know...maybe get to know the product architecture to find vulnerabilities? Maybe find out the architecture of a particular module? Maybe gain knowledge about a patented-part? It could be anything, but real interview. :)

      – Sourav Ghosh
      Mar 15 at 13:59






    • 7





      @ESR Not so much a scammer as a hacker. The first step of any hack is learning the technical details of the system you are targeting. The more you know about the system you are attacking, the more you can narrow down what kinds of vulnerabilities you need to exploit, and what kinds of protections are in place that you need to account for.

      – Nosajimiki
      Mar 15 at 14:26






    • 4





      I can think of a possible scam -- wanting to emulate this person's work history for immigration reasons?

      – Yakk
      Mar 15 at 17:14
















    94















    Is this recruiter/manager trying to steal the fruits of my labor or am I just paranoid?




    None, this looks like a scam.



    Under no circumstances, you are supposed to give away the exact minute details of the working project for your current employer, let alone the source code and/or documentation. That would be a serious violation of the contract in most of the countries and most likely you can end up facing criminal charges. No reasonable employer would even ask this of you (or any applicant).



    If they are willing to check "your skills" thoroughly, they can ask and arrange for an on-line or in-person coding test, there is nothing in your existing code that proves your skills. Heck, you might even showcase code written by someone else as yours, so there's nothing that can be proved by either sharing or receiving the code for your current employer.



    Stop communicating. Run fast and run away from this.






    share|improve this answer





















    • 51





      Instead of a scam it could also be social engineering based pen test. In either case the winning move is not to play.

      – Peter M
      Mar 15 at 13:37











    • @PeterM That's why I said "looks like". And I agree to the last sentence.

      – Sourav Ghosh
      Mar 15 at 13:38






    • 2





      @ESR Don't know...maybe get to know the product architecture to find vulnerabilities? Maybe find out the architecture of a particular module? Maybe gain knowledge about a patented-part? It could be anything, but real interview. :)

      – Sourav Ghosh
      Mar 15 at 13:59






    • 7





      @ESR Not so much a scammer as a hacker. The first step of any hack is learning the technical details of the system you are targeting. The more you know about the system you are attacking, the more you can narrow down what kinds of vulnerabilities you need to exploit, and what kinds of protections are in place that you need to account for.

      – Nosajimiki
      Mar 15 at 14:26






    • 4





      I can think of a possible scam -- wanting to emulate this person's work history for immigration reasons?

      – Yakk
      Mar 15 at 17:14














    94












    94








    94








    Is this recruiter/manager trying to steal the fruits of my labor or am I just paranoid?




    None, this looks like a scam.



    Under no circumstances, you are supposed to give away the exact minute details of the working project for your current employer, let alone the source code and/or documentation. That would be a serious violation of the contract in most of the countries and most likely you can end up facing criminal charges. No reasonable employer would even ask this of you (or any applicant).



    If they are willing to check "your skills" thoroughly, they can ask and arrange for an on-line or in-person coding test, there is nothing in your existing code that proves your skills. Heck, you might even showcase code written by someone else as yours, so there's nothing that can be proved by either sharing or receiving the code for your current employer.



    Stop communicating. Run fast and run away from this.






    share|improve this answer
















    Is this recruiter/manager trying to steal the fruits of my labor or am I just paranoid?




    None, this looks like a scam.



    Under no circumstances, you are supposed to give away the exact minute details of the working project for your current employer, let alone the source code and/or documentation. That would be a serious violation of the contract in most of the countries and most likely you can end up facing criminal charges. No reasonable employer would even ask this of you (or any applicant).



    If they are willing to check "your skills" thoroughly, they can ask and arrange for an on-line or in-person coding test, there is nothing in your existing code that proves your skills. Heck, you might even showcase code written by someone else as yours, so there's nothing that can be proved by either sharing or receiving the code for your current employer.



    Stop communicating. Run fast and run away from this.







    share|improve this answer














    share|improve this answer



    share|improve this answer








    edited Mar 15 at 19:23









    Kat

    2,80221318




    2,80221318










    answered Mar 15 at 13:30









    Sourav GhoshSourav Ghosh

    7,29643655




    7,29643655








    • 51





      Instead of a scam it could also be social engineering based pen test. In either case the winning move is not to play.

      – Peter M
      Mar 15 at 13:37











    • @PeterM That's why I said "looks like". And I agree to the last sentence.

      – Sourav Ghosh
      Mar 15 at 13:38






    • 2





      @ESR Don't know...maybe get to know the product architecture to find vulnerabilities? Maybe find out the architecture of a particular module? Maybe gain knowledge about a patented-part? It could be anything, but real interview. :)

      – Sourav Ghosh
      Mar 15 at 13:59






    • 7





      @ESR Not so much a scammer as a hacker. The first step of any hack is learning the technical details of the system you are targeting. The more you know about the system you are attacking, the more you can narrow down what kinds of vulnerabilities you need to exploit, and what kinds of protections are in place that you need to account for.

      – Nosajimiki
      Mar 15 at 14:26






    • 4





      I can think of a possible scam -- wanting to emulate this person's work history for immigration reasons?

      – Yakk
      Mar 15 at 17:14














    • 51





      Instead of a scam it could also be social engineering based pen test. In either case the winning move is not to play.

      – Peter M
      Mar 15 at 13:37











    • @PeterM That's why I said "looks like". And I agree to the last sentence.

      – Sourav Ghosh
      Mar 15 at 13:38






    • 2





      @ESR Don't know...maybe get to know the product architecture to find vulnerabilities? Maybe find out the architecture of a particular module? Maybe gain knowledge about a patented-part? It could be anything, but real interview. :)

      – Sourav Ghosh
      Mar 15 at 13:59






    • 7





      @ESR Not so much a scammer as a hacker. The first step of any hack is learning the technical details of the system you are targeting. The more you know about the system you are attacking, the more you can narrow down what kinds of vulnerabilities you need to exploit, and what kinds of protections are in place that you need to account for.

      – Nosajimiki
      Mar 15 at 14:26






    • 4





      I can think of a possible scam -- wanting to emulate this person's work history for immigration reasons?

      – Yakk
      Mar 15 at 17:14








    51




    51





    Instead of a scam it could also be social engineering based pen test. In either case the winning move is not to play.

    – Peter M
    Mar 15 at 13:37





    Instead of a scam it could also be social engineering based pen test. In either case the winning move is not to play.

    – Peter M
    Mar 15 at 13:37













    @PeterM That's why I said "looks like". And I agree to the last sentence.

    – Sourav Ghosh
    Mar 15 at 13:38





    @PeterM That's why I said "looks like". And I agree to the last sentence.

    – Sourav Ghosh
    Mar 15 at 13:38




    2




    2





    @ESR Don't know...maybe get to know the product architecture to find vulnerabilities? Maybe find out the architecture of a particular module? Maybe gain knowledge about a patented-part? It could be anything, but real interview. :)

    – Sourav Ghosh
    Mar 15 at 13:59





    @ESR Don't know...maybe get to know the product architecture to find vulnerabilities? Maybe find out the architecture of a particular module? Maybe gain knowledge about a patented-part? It could be anything, but real interview. :)

    – Sourav Ghosh
    Mar 15 at 13:59




    7




    7





    @ESR Not so much a scammer as a hacker. The first step of any hack is learning the technical details of the system you are targeting. The more you know about the system you are attacking, the more you can narrow down what kinds of vulnerabilities you need to exploit, and what kinds of protections are in place that you need to account for.

    – Nosajimiki
    Mar 15 at 14:26





    @ESR Not so much a scammer as a hacker. The first step of any hack is learning the technical details of the system you are targeting. The more you know about the system you are attacking, the more you can narrow down what kinds of vulnerabilities you need to exploit, and what kinds of protections are in place that you need to account for.

    – Nosajimiki
    Mar 15 at 14:26




    4




    4





    I can think of a possible scam -- wanting to emulate this person's work history for immigration reasons?

    – Yakk
    Mar 15 at 17:14





    I can think of a possible scam -- wanting to emulate this person's work history for immigration reasons?

    – Yakk
    Mar 15 at 17:14











    54














    If you currently work for a government contractor, report this to your security group



    This sounds like attempted industrial espionage and/or traditional espionage. If you work or have worked in any way for the government, directly or indirectly, report this to your security rep immediately.



    Otherwise, run away as fast as you can



    You could get into legal hot water by participating in what appears to be industrial espionage. Run away! If you have concerns that you may have already crossed legal boundaries by violating IP law or NDAs, contact a lawyer.






    share|improve this answer





















    • 2





      Yes, even if you worked for the government in the past. Or maybe even something on your profile that is typically government like intern at NASA or some research or grant in college that was eventually sold to the government.

      – Dan
      Mar 15 at 16:36








    • 2





      Updated based on your comment--thanks @Dan.

      – bob
      Mar 15 at 16:40











    • If you've left govt contracting and don't have a dod security rep at your current job, appropriate people to report a possible espionage attempt would be your old jobs security officer, a security officer at another contractor/govt office, or the FBI.

      – Dan Neely
      Mar 18 at 13:35
















    54














    If you currently work for a government contractor, report this to your security group



    This sounds like attempted industrial espionage and/or traditional espionage. If you work or have worked in any way for the government, directly or indirectly, report this to your security rep immediately.



    Otherwise, run away as fast as you can



    You could get into legal hot water by participating in what appears to be industrial espionage. Run away! If you have concerns that you may have already crossed legal boundaries by violating IP law or NDAs, contact a lawyer.






    share|improve this answer





















    • 2





      Yes, even if you worked for the government in the past. Or maybe even something on your profile that is typically government like intern at NASA or some research or grant in college that was eventually sold to the government.

      – Dan
      Mar 15 at 16:36








    • 2





      Updated based on your comment--thanks @Dan.

      – bob
      Mar 15 at 16:40











    • If you've left govt contracting and don't have a dod security rep at your current job, appropriate people to report a possible espionage attempt would be your old jobs security officer, a security officer at another contractor/govt office, or the FBI.

      – Dan Neely
      Mar 18 at 13:35














    54












    54








    54







    If you currently work for a government contractor, report this to your security group



    This sounds like attempted industrial espionage and/or traditional espionage. If you work or have worked in any way for the government, directly or indirectly, report this to your security rep immediately.



    Otherwise, run away as fast as you can



    You could get into legal hot water by participating in what appears to be industrial espionage. Run away! If you have concerns that you may have already crossed legal boundaries by violating IP law or NDAs, contact a lawyer.






    share|improve this answer















    If you currently work for a government contractor, report this to your security group



    This sounds like attempted industrial espionage and/or traditional espionage. If you work or have worked in any way for the government, directly or indirectly, report this to your security rep immediately.



    Otherwise, run away as fast as you can



    You could get into legal hot water by participating in what appears to be industrial espionage. Run away! If you have concerns that you may have already crossed legal boundaries by violating IP law or NDAs, contact a lawyer.







    share|improve this answer














    share|improve this answer



    share|improve this answer








    edited Mar 15 at 16:40

























    answered Mar 15 at 14:50









    bobbob

    2,5911618




    2,5911618








    • 2





      Yes, even if you worked for the government in the past. Or maybe even something on your profile that is typically government like intern at NASA or some research or grant in college that was eventually sold to the government.

      – Dan
      Mar 15 at 16:36








    • 2





      Updated based on your comment--thanks @Dan.

      – bob
      Mar 15 at 16:40











    • If you've left govt contracting and don't have a dod security rep at your current job, appropriate people to report a possible espionage attempt would be your old jobs security officer, a security officer at another contractor/govt office, or the FBI.

      – Dan Neely
      Mar 18 at 13:35














    • 2





      Yes, even if you worked for the government in the past. Or maybe even something on your profile that is typically government like intern at NASA or some research or grant in college that was eventually sold to the government.

      – Dan
      Mar 15 at 16:36








    • 2





      Updated based on your comment--thanks @Dan.

      – bob
      Mar 15 at 16:40











    • If you've left govt contracting and don't have a dod security rep at your current job, appropriate people to report a possible espionage attempt would be your old jobs security officer, a security officer at another contractor/govt office, or the FBI.

      – Dan Neely
      Mar 18 at 13:35








    2




    2





    Yes, even if you worked for the government in the past. Or maybe even something on your profile that is typically government like intern at NASA or some research or grant in college that was eventually sold to the government.

    – Dan
    Mar 15 at 16:36







    Yes, even if you worked for the government in the past. Or maybe even something on your profile that is typically government like intern at NASA or some research or grant in college that was eventually sold to the government.

    – Dan
    Mar 15 at 16:36






    2




    2





    Updated based on your comment--thanks @Dan.

    – bob
    Mar 15 at 16:40





    Updated based on your comment--thanks @Dan.

    – bob
    Mar 15 at 16:40













    If you've left govt contracting and don't have a dod security rep at your current job, appropriate people to report a possible espionage attempt would be your old jobs security officer, a security officer at another contractor/govt office, or the FBI.

    – Dan Neely
    Mar 18 at 13:35





    If you've left govt contracting and don't have a dod security rep at your current job, appropriate people to report a possible espionage attempt would be your old jobs security officer, a security officer at another contractor/govt office, or the FBI.

    – Dan Neely
    Mar 18 at 13:35











    16















    He mentioned how a similarly experienced developer had submitted 20 pages of such information and was asked for more. This is apparently an application requirement set by the position's manager. I said that it sounded like a lot of work but could get it to him sometime the next week.




    This might sound crazy but I wouldn't be surprised if the guy was some sort of state ran operative. It sounds like he's soliciting people with certain profiles to determine things. A 20 page technical detail sounds insane. Would you give 20 pages detailing everything you did to a stranger on a street just because they said they work as a recruiter for some company? Why would you trust a person on the internet asking for the same thing as someone would as a stranger on the streets?



    I wouldn't even reply. Just delete and continue on.






    share|improve this answer



















    • 7





      That's not crazy at all. However, the level of "attention" paid to one person indicates this is a very targeted activity. It could full well be part of a security audit.

      – Wesley Long
      Mar 15 at 14:58






    • 1





      @WesleyLong Yeah my guess is a keyword on his resume matches something. So he wants a technical detail to disguise what he's really asking. He already clued in that he'd ask for more even with a 20 page so he's likely to return with, "This is great, but tell me more about <insert what he really wants to know>? You're not very clear on X, Y, and Z of that part."

      – Dan
      Mar 15 at 16:46
















    16















    He mentioned how a similarly experienced developer had submitted 20 pages of such information and was asked for more. This is apparently an application requirement set by the position's manager. I said that it sounded like a lot of work but could get it to him sometime the next week.




    This might sound crazy but I wouldn't be surprised if the guy was some sort of state ran operative. It sounds like he's soliciting people with certain profiles to determine things. A 20 page technical detail sounds insane. Would you give 20 pages detailing everything you did to a stranger on a street just because they said they work as a recruiter for some company? Why would you trust a person on the internet asking for the same thing as someone would as a stranger on the streets?



    I wouldn't even reply. Just delete and continue on.






    share|improve this answer



















    • 7





      That's not crazy at all. However, the level of "attention" paid to one person indicates this is a very targeted activity. It could full well be part of a security audit.

      – Wesley Long
      Mar 15 at 14:58






    • 1





      @WesleyLong Yeah my guess is a keyword on his resume matches something. So he wants a technical detail to disguise what he's really asking. He already clued in that he'd ask for more even with a 20 page so he's likely to return with, "This is great, but tell me more about <insert what he really wants to know>? You're not very clear on X, Y, and Z of that part."

      – Dan
      Mar 15 at 16:46














    16












    16








    16








    He mentioned how a similarly experienced developer had submitted 20 pages of such information and was asked for more. This is apparently an application requirement set by the position's manager. I said that it sounded like a lot of work but could get it to him sometime the next week.




    This might sound crazy but I wouldn't be surprised if the guy was some sort of state ran operative. It sounds like he's soliciting people with certain profiles to determine things. A 20 page technical detail sounds insane. Would you give 20 pages detailing everything you did to a stranger on a street just because they said they work as a recruiter for some company? Why would you trust a person on the internet asking for the same thing as someone would as a stranger on the streets?



    I wouldn't even reply. Just delete and continue on.






    share|improve this answer














    He mentioned how a similarly experienced developer had submitted 20 pages of such information and was asked for more. This is apparently an application requirement set by the position's manager. I said that it sounded like a lot of work but could get it to him sometime the next week.




    This might sound crazy but I wouldn't be surprised if the guy was some sort of state ran operative. It sounds like he's soliciting people with certain profiles to determine things. A 20 page technical detail sounds insane. Would you give 20 pages detailing everything you did to a stranger on a street just because they said they work as a recruiter for some company? Why would you trust a person on the internet asking for the same thing as someone would as a stranger on the streets?



    I wouldn't even reply. Just delete and continue on.







    share|improve this answer












    share|improve this answer



    share|improve this answer










    answered Mar 15 at 14:02









    DanDan

    9,96931734




    9,96931734








    • 7





      That's not crazy at all. However, the level of "attention" paid to one person indicates this is a very targeted activity. It could full well be part of a security audit.

      – Wesley Long
      Mar 15 at 14:58






    • 1





      @WesleyLong Yeah my guess is a keyword on his resume matches something. So he wants a technical detail to disguise what he's really asking. He already clued in that he'd ask for more even with a 20 page so he's likely to return with, "This is great, but tell me more about <insert what he really wants to know>? You're not very clear on X, Y, and Z of that part."

      – Dan
      Mar 15 at 16:46














    • 7





      That's not crazy at all. However, the level of "attention" paid to one person indicates this is a very targeted activity. It could full well be part of a security audit.

      – Wesley Long
      Mar 15 at 14:58






    • 1





      @WesleyLong Yeah my guess is a keyword on his resume matches something. So he wants a technical detail to disguise what he's really asking. He already clued in that he'd ask for more even with a 20 page so he's likely to return with, "This is great, but tell me more about <insert what he really wants to know>? You're not very clear on X, Y, and Z of that part."

      – Dan
      Mar 15 at 16:46








    7




    7





    That's not crazy at all. However, the level of "attention" paid to one person indicates this is a very targeted activity. It could full well be part of a security audit.

    – Wesley Long
    Mar 15 at 14:58





    That's not crazy at all. However, the level of "attention" paid to one person indicates this is a very targeted activity. It could full well be part of a security audit.

    – Wesley Long
    Mar 15 at 14:58




    1




    1





    @WesleyLong Yeah my guess is a keyword on his resume matches something. So he wants a technical detail to disguise what he's really asking. He already clued in that he'd ask for more even with a 20 page so he's likely to return with, "This is great, but tell me more about <insert what he really wants to know>? You're not very clear on X, Y, and Z of that part."

    – Dan
    Mar 15 at 16:46





    @WesleyLong Yeah my guess is a keyword on his resume matches something. So he wants a technical detail to disguise what he's really asking. He already clued in that he'd ask for more even with a 20 page so he's likely to return with, "This is great, but tell me more about <insert what he really wants to know>? You're not very clear on X, Y, and Z of that part."

    – Dan
    Mar 15 at 16:46











    9














    I would strongly recommend that you inform your previous employers about this recruiter, because this is most likely an attempt at company espionage. Technical details like this are none of his business. If he says that someone submitted 20 pages of such documentation, then the recruiter is frankly lying. And I have never, ever encountered a prospective employer who was interested in that kind of information - actually, most wouldn’t want to know that kind of thing because of fear of legal consequences.






    share|improve this answer
























    • This. This is my suspicion, too. This level of technical detail is very uncommon on the field, even for some rare, seldom used techs.

      – T. Sar
      Mar 17 at 18:12
















    9














    I would strongly recommend that you inform your previous employers about this recruiter, because this is most likely an attempt at company espionage. Technical details like this are none of his business. If he says that someone submitted 20 pages of such documentation, then the recruiter is frankly lying. And I have never, ever encountered a prospective employer who was interested in that kind of information - actually, most wouldn’t want to know that kind of thing because of fear of legal consequences.






    share|improve this answer
























    • This. This is my suspicion, too. This level of technical detail is very uncommon on the field, even for some rare, seldom used techs.

      – T. Sar
      Mar 17 at 18:12














    9












    9








    9







    I would strongly recommend that you inform your previous employers about this recruiter, because this is most likely an attempt at company espionage. Technical details like this are none of his business. If he says that someone submitted 20 pages of such documentation, then the recruiter is frankly lying. And I have never, ever encountered a prospective employer who was interested in that kind of information - actually, most wouldn’t want to know that kind of thing because of fear of legal consequences.






    share|improve this answer













    I would strongly recommend that you inform your previous employers about this recruiter, because this is most likely an attempt at company espionage. Technical details like this are none of his business. If he says that someone submitted 20 pages of such documentation, then the recruiter is frankly lying. And I have never, ever encountered a prospective employer who was interested in that kind of information - actually, most wouldn’t want to know that kind of thing because of fear of legal consequences.







    share|improve this answer












    share|improve this answer



    share|improve this answer










    answered Mar 15 at 21:04









    gnasher729gnasher729

    89.7k40157281




    89.7k40157281













    • This. This is my suspicion, too. This level of technical detail is very uncommon on the field, even for some rare, seldom used techs.

      – T. Sar
      Mar 17 at 18:12



















    • This. This is my suspicion, too. This level of technical detail is very uncommon on the field, even for some rare, seldom used techs.

      – T. Sar
      Mar 17 at 18:12

















    This. This is my suspicion, too. This level of technical detail is very uncommon on the field, even for some rare, seldom used techs.

    – T. Sar
    Mar 17 at 18:12





    This. This is my suspicion, too. This level of technical detail is very uncommon on the field, even for some rare, seldom used techs.

    – T. Sar
    Mar 17 at 18:12











    4














    I'm from an Engineering background, but it would definitely raise a few flags for me. The only way I would even consider showing anything is in a personal meeting, printed on paper, and take it back when I leave.



    Don't send anything, as you might be delivering company secrets to a competitor. Disclosing any sensitive information should be done only after getting an NDA signed.



    I would question any additional request from this so-called recruiter.






    share|improve this answer





















    • 8





      You would have absolutely no rights to share any code, even upon acquiring a NDA. And NDAs cover sharing information with 3rd parties. The recruiter may be the competitor themselves! NDAs are also signed by those receiving the privileged information, not the one sending. Signing a NDA, then handing over privileged information to someone else doesn't make sense on an almost comical level.

      – Gregory Currie
      Mar 15 at 10:14






    • 6





      I think maybe I'm not explaining myself either. If person X, works for company Y, and recruiter Z is to meet with person X. For any NDA to have an effect, it must be between company Y and recruiter Z. The intellectual property belongs to company Y. Disclosing the IP is likely a breach of X's employee contract, regardless of whatever contractual conditions person X reaches with recruiter Z.

      – Gregory Currie
      Mar 15 at 10:27






    • 1





      It really depends what the employee contract states. As an aside, even discussing a patent can reveal information not in the patent. You also state that "Disclosing any sensitive information should be done only after getting an NDA signed." which I understand to mean... well... what it says. In addition, you say you are printing out "something like that", I'm not sure exactly what "that" means, can be several things. I'm not trying to analyse your answer to death, but it includes advice that allows the OP to be fired immediately.

      – Gregory Currie
      Mar 15 at 10:39








    • 2





      It's actually trivially easy to not talk about the specifics of work, and to be honest, most employees will not ask such questions. It's even easier to not share code belonging to your current employer and present it to a third party. In a lot of places doing so is instant dismissal. Giving the false sense that an NDA will somehow protect the employee is really dangerous to reader, and you should really consider rewording your answer.

      – Gregory Currie
      Mar 15 at 11:40






    • 2





      Disclosing any confidential information about your current or previous employer should happen NOT AT ALL. NEVER.

      – gnasher729
      Mar 15 at 21:07
















    4














    I'm from an Engineering background, but it would definitely raise a few flags for me. The only way I would even consider showing anything is in a personal meeting, printed on paper, and take it back when I leave.



    Don't send anything, as you might be delivering company secrets to a competitor. Disclosing any sensitive information should be done only after getting an NDA signed.



    I would question any additional request from this so-called recruiter.






    share|improve this answer





















    • 8





      You would have absolutely no rights to share any code, even upon acquiring a NDA. And NDAs cover sharing information with 3rd parties. The recruiter may be the competitor themselves! NDAs are also signed by those receiving the privileged information, not the one sending. Signing a NDA, then handing over privileged information to someone else doesn't make sense on an almost comical level.

      – Gregory Currie
      Mar 15 at 10:14






    • 6





      I think maybe I'm not explaining myself either. If person X, works for company Y, and recruiter Z is to meet with person X. For any NDA to have an effect, it must be between company Y and recruiter Z. The intellectual property belongs to company Y. Disclosing the IP is likely a breach of X's employee contract, regardless of whatever contractual conditions person X reaches with recruiter Z.

      – Gregory Currie
      Mar 15 at 10:27






    • 1





      It really depends what the employee contract states. As an aside, even discussing a patent can reveal information not in the patent. You also state that "Disclosing any sensitive information should be done only after getting an NDA signed." which I understand to mean... well... what it says. In addition, you say you are printing out "something like that", I'm not sure exactly what "that" means, can be several things. I'm not trying to analyse your answer to death, but it includes advice that allows the OP to be fired immediately.

      – Gregory Currie
      Mar 15 at 10:39








    • 2





      It's actually trivially easy to not talk about the specifics of work, and to be honest, most employees will not ask such questions. It's even easier to not share code belonging to your current employer and present it to a third party. In a lot of places doing so is instant dismissal. Giving the false sense that an NDA will somehow protect the employee is really dangerous to reader, and you should really consider rewording your answer.

      – Gregory Currie
      Mar 15 at 11:40






    • 2





      Disclosing any confidential information about your current or previous employer should happen NOT AT ALL. NEVER.

      – gnasher729
      Mar 15 at 21:07














    4












    4








    4







    I'm from an Engineering background, but it would definitely raise a few flags for me. The only way I would even consider showing anything is in a personal meeting, printed on paper, and take it back when I leave.



    Don't send anything, as you might be delivering company secrets to a competitor. Disclosing any sensitive information should be done only after getting an NDA signed.



    I would question any additional request from this so-called recruiter.






    share|improve this answer















    I'm from an Engineering background, but it would definitely raise a few flags for me. The only way I would even consider showing anything is in a personal meeting, printed on paper, and take it back when I leave.



    Don't send anything, as you might be delivering company secrets to a competitor. Disclosing any sensitive information should be done only after getting an NDA signed.



    I would question any additional request from this so-called recruiter.







    share|improve this answer














    share|improve this answer



    share|improve this answer








    edited Mar 15 at 11:46

























    answered Mar 15 at 10:07









    YuryYury

    3056




    3056








    • 8





      You would have absolutely no rights to share any code, even upon acquiring a NDA. And NDAs cover sharing information with 3rd parties. The recruiter may be the competitor themselves! NDAs are also signed by those receiving the privileged information, not the one sending. Signing a NDA, then handing over privileged information to someone else doesn't make sense on an almost comical level.

      – Gregory Currie
      Mar 15 at 10:14






    • 6





      I think maybe I'm not explaining myself either. If person X, works for company Y, and recruiter Z is to meet with person X. For any NDA to have an effect, it must be between company Y and recruiter Z. The intellectual property belongs to company Y. Disclosing the IP is likely a breach of X's employee contract, regardless of whatever contractual conditions person X reaches with recruiter Z.

      – Gregory Currie
      Mar 15 at 10:27






    • 1





      It really depends what the employee contract states. As an aside, even discussing a patent can reveal information not in the patent. You also state that "Disclosing any sensitive information should be done only after getting an NDA signed." which I understand to mean... well... what it says. In addition, you say you are printing out "something like that", I'm not sure exactly what "that" means, can be several things. I'm not trying to analyse your answer to death, but it includes advice that allows the OP to be fired immediately.

      – Gregory Currie
      Mar 15 at 10:39








    • 2





      It's actually trivially easy to not talk about the specifics of work, and to be honest, most employees will not ask such questions. It's even easier to not share code belonging to your current employer and present it to a third party. In a lot of places doing so is instant dismissal. Giving the false sense that an NDA will somehow protect the employee is really dangerous to reader, and you should really consider rewording your answer.

      – Gregory Currie
      Mar 15 at 11:40






    • 2





      Disclosing any confidential information about your current or previous employer should happen NOT AT ALL. NEVER.

      – gnasher729
      Mar 15 at 21:07














    • 8





      You would have absolutely no rights to share any code, even upon acquiring a NDA. And NDAs cover sharing information with 3rd parties. The recruiter may be the competitor themselves! NDAs are also signed by those receiving the privileged information, not the one sending. Signing a NDA, then handing over privileged information to someone else doesn't make sense on an almost comical level.

      – Gregory Currie
      Mar 15 at 10:14






    • 6





      I think maybe I'm not explaining myself either. If person X, works for company Y, and recruiter Z is to meet with person X. For any NDA to have an effect, it must be between company Y and recruiter Z. The intellectual property belongs to company Y. Disclosing the IP is likely a breach of X's employee contract, regardless of whatever contractual conditions person X reaches with recruiter Z.

      – Gregory Currie
      Mar 15 at 10:27






    • 1





      It really depends what the employee contract states. As an aside, even discussing a patent can reveal information not in the patent. You also state that "Disclosing any sensitive information should be done only after getting an NDA signed." which I understand to mean... well... what it says. In addition, you say you are printing out "something like that", I'm not sure exactly what "that" means, can be several things. I'm not trying to analyse your answer to death, but it includes advice that allows the OP to be fired immediately.

      – Gregory Currie
      Mar 15 at 10:39








    • 2





      It's actually trivially easy to not talk about the specifics of work, and to be honest, most employees will not ask such questions. It's even easier to not share code belonging to your current employer and present it to a third party. In a lot of places doing so is instant dismissal. Giving the false sense that an NDA will somehow protect the employee is really dangerous to reader, and you should really consider rewording your answer.

      – Gregory Currie
      Mar 15 at 11:40






    • 2





      Disclosing any confidential information about your current or previous employer should happen NOT AT ALL. NEVER.

      – gnasher729
      Mar 15 at 21:07








    8




    8





    You would have absolutely no rights to share any code, even upon acquiring a NDA. And NDAs cover sharing information with 3rd parties. The recruiter may be the competitor themselves! NDAs are also signed by those receiving the privileged information, not the one sending. Signing a NDA, then handing over privileged information to someone else doesn't make sense on an almost comical level.

    – Gregory Currie
    Mar 15 at 10:14





    You would have absolutely no rights to share any code, even upon acquiring a NDA. And NDAs cover sharing information with 3rd parties. The recruiter may be the competitor themselves! NDAs are also signed by those receiving the privileged information, not the one sending. Signing a NDA, then handing over privileged information to someone else doesn't make sense on an almost comical level.

    – Gregory Currie
    Mar 15 at 10:14




    6




    6





    I think maybe I'm not explaining myself either. If person X, works for company Y, and recruiter Z is to meet with person X. For any NDA to have an effect, it must be between company Y and recruiter Z. The intellectual property belongs to company Y. Disclosing the IP is likely a breach of X's employee contract, regardless of whatever contractual conditions person X reaches with recruiter Z.

    – Gregory Currie
    Mar 15 at 10:27





    I think maybe I'm not explaining myself either. If person X, works for company Y, and recruiter Z is to meet with person X. For any NDA to have an effect, it must be between company Y and recruiter Z. The intellectual property belongs to company Y. Disclosing the IP is likely a breach of X's employee contract, regardless of whatever contractual conditions person X reaches with recruiter Z.

    – Gregory Currie
    Mar 15 at 10:27




    1




    1





    It really depends what the employee contract states. As an aside, even discussing a patent can reveal information not in the patent. You also state that "Disclosing any sensitive information should be done only after getting an NDA signed." which I understand to mean... well... what it says. In addition, you say you are printing out "something like that", I'm not sure exactly what "that" means, can be several things. I'm not trying to analyse your answer to death, but it includes advice that allows the OP to be fired immediately.

    – Gregory Currie
    Mar 15 at 10:39







    It really depends what the employee contract states. As an aside, even discussing a patent can reveal information not in the patent. You also state that "Disclosing any sensitive information should be done only after getting an NDA signed." which I understand to mean... well... what it says. In addition, you say you are printing out "something like that", I'm not sure exactly what "that" means, can be several things. I'm not trying to analyse your answer to death, but it includes advice that allows the OP to be fired immediately.

    – Gregory Currie
    Mar 15 at 10:39






    2




    2





    It's actually trivially easy to not talk about the specifics of work, and to be honest, most employees will not ask such questions. It's even easier to not share code belonging to your current employer and present it to a third party. In a lot of places doing so is instant dismissal. Giving the false sense that an NDA will somehow protect the employee is really dangerous to reader, and you should really consider rewording your answer.

    – Gregory Currie
    Mar 15 at 11:40





    It's actually trivially easy to not talk about the specifics of work, and to be honest, most employees will not ask such questions. It's even easier to not share code belonging to your current employer and present it to a third party. In a lot of places doing so is instant dismissal. Giving the false sense that an NDA will somehow protect the employee is really dangerous to reader, and you should really consider rewording your answer.

    – Gregory Currie
    Mar 15 at 11:40




    2




    2





    Disclosing any confidential information about your current or previous employer should happen NOT AT ALL. NEVER.

    – gnasher729
    Mar 15 at 21:07





    Disclosing any confidential information about your current or previous employer should happen NOT AT ALL. NEVER.

    – gnasher729
    Mar 15 at 21:07











    2














    As best as I can guess, one of two things is happening here, neither of which is good:



    1) The company is asking you for reams and reams of data just because they can. They want to see if you'll do it, knowing full well that no real hiring manager will actually read the entire body of your corpus (plus, it's code not prose, so it's much more difficult to read). They're putting you through the paces to see how well you acclimatize to ridiculous requests. This means that you can be expected, on the job, to field such ridiculous requests and expected to do them. This is not good.



    2) The company has such few applicants that the hiring manager has the spare time to read reams and reams of code from applicants to determine the good ones. This is a job nobody wants, and for good reason (because they ask for your entire corpus of everything you've ever done!). If nobody else wants to be associated with this company, why should you? Furthermore, it also speaks to the level of micromanagement in the company, where the hiring manager wants to read every line of code you're ever going to write, and has nothing better to do with their time than critique every member of their team personally and individually on a line-by-line basis. Run away from this type of micromanagement.



    In any case, submit what you think is reasonable. Do not submit any code you have written for any employer, that's almost certainly very illegal. Take like 15 minutes of your time and put together a set of projects you have completed that you would feel comfortable submitting and ship it to them as a portfolio. If that's not enough for them, then simply say "sorry, that's all I have for you, if that's not enough then I think we're done here".



    For future, you might want to consider hosting your personal projects on GitHub so that anyone can easily peruse your portfolio at their leisure rather than putting in this much work. It's near-zero work for you to put together a GitHub account, and then you don't have to go through this. Simply say "Look at my GitHub" and be done with it.






    share|improve this answer




























      2














      As best as I can guess, one of two things is happening here, neither of which is good:



      1) The company is asking you for reams and reams of data just because they can. They want to see if you'll do it, knowing full well that no real hiring manager will actually read the entire body of your corpus (plus, it's code not prose, so it's much more difficult to read). They're putting you through the paces to see how well you acclimatize to ridiculous requests. This means that you can be expected, on the job, to field such ridiculous requests and expected to do them. This is not good.



      2) The company has such few applicants that the hiring manager has the spare time to read reams and reams of code from applicants to determine the good ones. This is a job nobody wants, and for good reason (because they ask for your entire corpus of everything you've ever done!). If nobody else wants to be associated with this company, why should you? Furthermore, it also speaks to the level of micromanagement in the company, where the hiring manager wants to read every line of code you're ever going to write, and has nothing better to do with their time than critique every member of their team personally and individually on a line-by-line basis. Run away from this type of micromanagement.



      In any case, submit what you think is reasonable. Do not submit any code you have written for any employer, that's almost certainly very illegal. Take like 15 minutes of your time and put together a set of projects you have completed that you would feel comfortable submitting and ship it to them as a portfolio. If that's not enough for them, then simply say "sorry, that's all I have for you, if that's not enough then I think we're done here".



      For future, you might want to consider hosting your personal projects on GitHub so that anyone can easily peruse your portfolio at their leisure rather than putting in this much work. It's near-zero work for you to put together a GitHub account, and then you don't have to go through this. Simply say "Look at my GitHub" and be done with it.






      share|improve this answer


























        2












        2








        2







        As best as I can guess, one of two things is happening here, neither of which is good:



        1) The company is asking you for reams and reams of data just because they can. They want to see if you'll do it, knowing full well that no real hiring manager will actually read the entire body of your corpus (plus, it's code not prose, so it's much more difficult to read). They're putting you through the paces to see how well you acclimatize to ridiculous requests. This means that you can be expected, on the job, to field such ridiculous requests and expected to do them. This is not good.



        2) The company has such few applicants that the hiring manager has the spare time to read reams and reams of code from applicants to determine the good ones. This is a job nobody wants, and for good reason (because they ask for your entire corpus of everything you've ever done!). If nobody else wants to be associated with this company, why should you? Furthermore, it also speaks to the level of micromanagement in the company, where the hiring manager wants to read every line of code you're ever going to write, and has nothing better to do with their time than critique every member of their team personally and individually on a line-by-line basis. Run away from this type of micromanagement.



        In any case, submit what you think is reasonable. Do not submit any code you have written for any employer, that's almost certainly very illegal. Take like 15 minutes of your time and put together a set of projects you have completed that you would feel comfortable submitting and ship it to them as a portfolio. If that's not enough for them, then simply say "sorry, that's all I have for you, if that's not enough then I think we're done here".



        For future, you might want to consider hosting your personal projects on GitHub so that anyone can easily peruse your portfolio at their leisure rather than putting in this much work. It's near-zero work for you to put together a GitHub account, and then you don't have to go through this. Simply say "Look at my GitHub" and be done with it.






        share|improve this answer













        As best as I can guess, one of two things is happening here, neither of which is good:



        1) The company is asking you for reams and reams of data just because they can. They want to see if you'll do it, knowing full well that no real hiring manager will actually read the entire body of your corpus (plus, it's code not prose, so it's much more difficult to read). They're putting you through the paces to see how well you acclimatize to ridiculous requests. This means that you can be expected, on the job, to field such ridiculous requests and expected to do them. This is not good.



        2) The company has such few applicants that the hiring manager has the spare time to read reams and reams of code from applicants to determine the good ones. This is a job nobody wants, and for good reason (because they ask for your entire corpus of everything you've ever done!). If nobody else wants to be associated with this company, why should you? Furthermore, it also speaks to the level of micromanagement in the company, where the hiring manager wants to read every line of code you're ever going to write, and has nothing better to do with their time than critique every member of their team personally and individually on a line-by-line basis. Run away from this type of micromanagement.



        In any case, submit what you think is reasonable. Do not submit any code you have written for any employer, that's almost certainly very illegal. Take like 15 minutes of your time and put together a set of projects you have completed that you would feel comfortable submitting and ship it to them as a portfolio. If that's not enough for them, then simply say "sorry, that's all I have for you, if that's not enough then I think we're done here".



        For future, you might want to consider hosting your personal projects on GitHub so that anyone can easily peruse your portfolio at their leisure rather than putting in this much work. It's near-zero work for you to put together a GitHub account, and then you don't have to go through this. Simply say "Look at my GitHub" and be done with it.







        share|improve this answer












        share|improve this answer



        share|improve this answer










        answered Mar 15 at 19:18









        Ertai87Ertai87

        11.1k21331




        11.1k21331






























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