First use of “packing” as in carrying a gun
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A friend is using the sentence, “Nobody was packing there,” in an historical novel set in the 1885-90 timeframe.
I suspect “packing” was not used in this slang format until 30-40 years later?
Does anyone have corroboration?
etymology
asked 2 days ago
RichRich
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A friend is using the sentence, “Nobody was packing there,” in an historical novel set in the 1885-90 timeframe.
I suspect “packing” was not used in this slang format until 30-40 years later?
Does anyone have corroboration?
etymology
asked 2 days ago
RichRich
311
New contributor
Rich is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
1
Possible duplicate of What does “packing heat” mean?
– Ubi hatt
2 days ago
Thanks for the question. Without more context, any answer needs qualification. For example, "The pack horses had to be left outside of town while the men went on in. Nobody was packing there." gives one context for your friend's sentence, but "In Carson City [in the 1890s] men packing a pistol were hung for being dangerous cowards. Nobody was packing there." gives quite another. Neither use would be anachronistic in a historical novel set in the 1890s.
– JEL
yesterday
Note also that in the 1890s another idiom was in use: 'packing a [weapon] for [somebody]' meant that the weapon was being carryed for the purpose or with the intent of using it on the indirect object (somebody). The weapon involved was generally a knife or gun.
– JEL
yesterday
It may be worth comparing to "packs a punch", which seems to have been newish in 1912, where it appears in scare quotes. books.google.com/books/…
– Phil Sweet
yesterday
add a comment |
A friend is using the sentence, “Nobody was packing there,” in an historical novel set in the 1885-90 timeframe.
I suspect “packing” was not used in this slang format until 30-40 years later?
Does anyone have corroboration?
etymology
asked 2 days ago
RichRich
311
New contributor
Rich is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
A friend is using the sentence, “Nobody was packing there,” in an historical novel set in the 1885-90 timeframe.
I suspect “packing” was not used in this slang format until 30-40 years later?
Does anyone have corroboration?
etymology
etymology
asked 2 days ago
RichRich
311
New contributor
Rich is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
asked 2 days ago
RichRich
311
New contributor
Rich is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
asked 2 days ago
RichRich
311
New contributor
Rich is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
asked 2 days ago
RichRich
311
asked 2 days ago
RichRich
311
311
New contributor
Rich is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
New contributor
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Check out our Code of Conduct.
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Check out our Code of Conduct.
1
Possible duplicate of What does “packing heat” mean?
– Ubi hatt
2 days ago
Thanks for the question. Without more context, any answer needs qualification. For example, "The pack horses had to be left outside of town while the men went on in. Nobody was packing there." gives one context for your friend's sentence, but "In Carson City [in the 1890s] men packing a pistol were hung for being dangerous cowards. Nobody was packing there." gives quite another. Neither use would be anachronistic in a historical novel set in the 1890s.
– JEL
yesterday
Note also that in the 1890s another idiom was in use: 'packing a [weapon] for [somebody]' meant that the weapon was being carryed for the purpose or with the intent of using it on the indirect object (somebody). The weapon involved was generally a knife or gun.
– JEL
yesterday
It may be worth comparing to "packs a punch", which seems to have been newish in 1912, where it appears in scare quotes. books.google.com/books/…
– Phil Sweet
yesterday
add a comment |
1
Possible duplicate of What does “packing heat” mean?
– Ubi hatt
2 days ago
Thanks for the question. Without more context, any answer needs qualification. For example, "The pack horses had to be left outside of town while the men went on in. Nobody was packing there." gives one context for your friend's sentence, but "In Carson City [in the 1890s] men packing a pistol were hung for being dangerous cowards. Nobody was packing there." gives quite another. Neither use would be anachronistic in a historical novel set in the 1890s.
– JEL
yesterday
Note also that in the 1890s another idiom was in use: 'packing a [weapon] for [somebody]' meant that the weapon was being carryed for the purpose or with the intent of using it on the indirect object (somebody). The weapon involved was generally a knife or gun.
– JEL
yesterday
It may be worth comparing to "packs a punch", which seems to have been newish in 1912, where it appears in scare quotes. books.google.com/books/…
– Phil Sweet
yesterday
1
1
Possible duplicate of What does “packing heat” mean?
– Ubi hatt
2 days ago
Possible duplicate of What does “packing heat” mean?
– Ubi hatt
2 days ago
Thanks for the question. Without more context, any answer needs qualification. For example, "The pack horses had to be left outside of town while the men went on in. Nobody was packing there." gives one context for your friend's sentence, but "In Carson City [in the 1890s] men packing a pistol were hung for being dangerous cowards. Nobody was packing there." gives quite another. Neither use would be anachronistic in a historical novel set in the 1890s.
– JEL
yesterday
Thanks for the question. Without more context, any answer needs qualification. For example, "The pack horses had to be left outside of town while the men went on in. Nobody was packing there." gives one context for your friend's sentence, but "In Carson City [in the 1890s] men packing a pistol were hung for being dangerous cowards. Nobody was packing there." gives quite another. Neither use would be anachronistic in a historical novel set in the 1890s.
– JEL
yesterday
Note also that in the 1890s another idiom was in use: 'packing a [weapon] for [somebody]' meant that the weapon was being carryed for the purpose or with the intent of using it on the indirect object (somebody). The weapon involved was generally a knife or gun.
– JEL
yesterday
Note also that in the 1890s another idiom was in use: 'packing a [weapon] for [somebody]' meant that the weapon was being carryed for the purpose or with the intent of using it on the indirect object (somebody). The weapon involved was generally a knife or gun.
– JEL
yesterday
It may be worth comparing to "packs a punch", which seems to have been newish in 1912, where it appears in scare quotes. books.google.com/books/…
– Phil Sweet
yesterday
It may be worth comparing to "packs a punch", which seems to have been newish in 1912, where it appears in scare quotes. books.google.com/books/…
– Phil Sweet
yesterday
add a comment |
4 Answers
4
active
oldest
votes
The earliest instance related to "packing a gun" that I've been able to find is this one, from a poem titled "St. Valentines day," in the [Springfield] Illinois Journal (February 16, 1852):
Then the second notion was, to save so much runnin / Arter the gals, which 'pays'—about as well as 'gunnin'— / Which don't pay at all, if you never tried it, take my word for it; / For, in my day, I've 'packed' a gun until I fairly abhor it.
I agree with KarlG's conclusion that "packing"—without "a gun," "a pistol," or "a weapon"—in the sense of carrying a firearm, and in particular a handgun—is a much later development. I suspect that his discovery of a 1970 instance of such usage will be hard to beat.
answered yesterday
Sven YargsSven Yargs
115k20251508
1
Green provides a 1962 citation to Yablonski, The Violent Gang (the link is to the 2009 edition, but I checked the 1962 edition and found the same uses; see pp. 100, 114, 122; contextual evidence suggests the uses were in the early 1950s for at least 'packed'--"Chino was 'packed.'"). Given the prevalence of anti-packing sentiment associated with "pistol-packing", "packing a gun", etc. in 1890s cities, it seems ill-advised to rule out elliptical uses such as are evidenced in Yablonski.
– JEL
yesterday
1
@JEL: The book is waitlisted so I can’t access it, but does the book cite the usage generally, or particular gang members. If the latter, were they African American? I'm wondering if the omission of object first occurred in AAVE.
– KarlG
yesterday
1
@JEL: Your point about elliptical use seems very reasonable—especially in a situation where some form of "packing a [weapon]" appears nearby. Two related modern usages (at least in the United States) involve "carrying" (money [1930s+], weapons [1930s+], or drugs [1940s+]) and "holding" (drugs [1930s+] or money [1930s+]). The dates are from Green, but they appear to involve use of the words unattached to an explicit object; as with "packing," forms of the expression that include an explicit object go back to the nineteenth century, Green says.
– Sven Yargs
yesterday
@KarlG, particular gang members are quoted, or paraphrased using their slang. About the members, I couldn't say what their backgrounds were; the gangs were mixed, reflecting the neighborhoods.
– JEL
20 hours ago
add a comment |
from Etymonline.com pack
Sense of "to carry or convey in a pack" (1805) led to general sense of
"to carry in any manner;" hence to pack heat "carry a gun,"
and OED
1865 Atlantic Monthly One of the best of Rosecrans's scouts..lost
his life because he would..‘pack’ (carry) his gun.
answered yesterday
lbflbf
22.4k22575
Where did you dig up the Atlantic Monthly quote? It didn’t show up in a COHA collocation search.
– KarlG
yesterday
You can find the entire October 1865 Atlantic quote here. Interestingly, the context involves a "scout" from eastern Kentucky working for the U.S. army who was found out by southern troops in the Confederate army because his dialect and habits differed from those of soldiers who really were from the mountains of Alabama, as he claimed to be.
– Sven Yargs
yesterday
1
Also of interest, from deposition taken March 19, 1869, from Andrew Hampton in Barnes vs. Adams: "Q. Did you never carry a gun, and go in company with Union soldiers ; and were you ever in the service as a soldier? — A. I have packed a gun to try to protect myself and my property, and to try to keep these men from stealing my property. I never was a soldier in any army."
– Sven Yargs
yesterday
add a comment |
Packing meaning to carry a firearm is a shortened form of packing a gun/pistol etc., which emerges in the Western and Southwestern states and territories at least by the 1870s:
We should be glad to see William out of his troubles but he must quit “packing a pistol” and playing fighter. — Carson Daily Appeal (Carson City NV), 14 May 1873.
Q. The other men who came up, what did they come up for? —A. I didn’t see them until they got right up there.
Q. Did they have anything in their hands? —A. They were packing guns. — Modoc War, US House of Representatives, Message from the President [Grant], Washington DC, 1874.
The quotation marks around the phrase in the Nevada newspaper suggests a fairly new usage.
I suspect that the shortened form, i. e., with no direct object, is a late 20th c. innovation:
The brothers were packing, but that was not unusual; the Party was under surveillance at the time because of the fear of us starting trouble in Oakland after Dr. King's death … — Earl Anthony, Picking Up the Gun: a Report on the Black Panthers, 1970, 107.
Your friend is safe using pack a pistol etc., but it would be wise not to use the verb without a direct object for a narrative set in the late 19th c.
answered yesterday
KarlGKarlG
24k73567
add a comment |
1898:
He passed in between his horse and that of his son's, "and got on the
west side of my son, and said to him: 'You are packing a gun for me,
and now, then, God damn you, use it' " At this, witness wheeled his
horse, and jumped off.
The Southwestern Reporter, June 27 -- August 22, 1898
Ngram finds one earlier use of "packing a gun", but it appears to refer to loading a cannon.
answered 2 days ago
Hot LicksHot Licks
19.5k23777
1
OP thinks that packing meaning "carrying a gun".
– Ubi hatt
2 days ago
1
@Ubihatt - And that is the sense that the above quote appears to be using.
– Hot Licks
2 days ago
1
I always thought it was just short for packing heat.
– KarlG
2 days ago
1
@KarlG yep! you are correct. Packing heat means carrying a gun.
– Ubi hatt
2 days ago
1
@Ubihatt - I don't understand. If you read the context (click on the link) the quote clearly refers to carrying a gun. "Packing heat" didn't enter the argot until the 1980s.
– Hot Licks
2 days ago
|
show 3 more comments
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4 Answers
4
active
oldest
votes
4 Answers
4
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
The earliest instance related to "packing a gun" that I've been able to find is this one, from a poem titled "St. Valentines day," in the [Springfield] Illinois Journal (February 16, 1852):
Then the second notion was, to save so much runnin / Arter the gals, which 'pays'—about as well as 'gunnin'— / Which don't pay at all, if you never tried it, take my word for it; / For, in my day, I've 'packed' a gun until I fairly abhor it.
I agree with KarlG's conclusion that "packing"—without "a gun," "a pistol," or "a weapon"—in the sense of carrying a firearm, and in particular a handgun—is a much later development. I suspect that his discovery of a 1970 instance of such usage will be hard to beat.
answered yesterday
Sven YargsSven Yargs
115k20251508
1
Green provides a 1962 citation to Yablonski, The Violent Gang (the link is to the 2009 edition, but I checked the 1962 edition and found the same uses; see pp. 100, 114, 122; contextual evidence suggests the uses were in the early 1950s for at least 'packed'--"Chino was 'packed.'"). Given the prevalence of anti-packing sentiment associated with "pistol-packing", "packing a gun", etc. in 1890s cities, it seems ill-advised to rule out elliptical uses such as are evidenced in Yablonski.
– JEL
yesterday
1
@JEL: The book is waitlisted so I can’t access it, but does the book cite the usage generally, or particular gang members. If the latter, were they African American? I'm wondering if the omission of object first occurred in AAVE.
– KarlG
yesterday
1
@JEL: Your point about elliptical use seems very reasonable—especially in a situation where some form of "packing a [weapon]" appears nearby. Two related modern usages (at least in the United States) involve "carrying" (money [1930s+], weapons [1930s+], or drugs [1940s+]) and "holding" (drugs [1930s+] or money [1930s+]). The dates are from Green, but they appear to involve use of the words unattached to an explicit object; as with "packing," forms of the expression that include an explicit object go back to the nineteenth century, Green says.
– Sven Yargs
yesterday
@KarlG, particular gang members are quoted, or paraphrased using their slang. About the members, I couldn't say what their backgrounds were; the gangs were mixed, reflecting the neighborhoods.
– JEL
20 hours ago
add a comment |
The earliest instance related to "packing a gun" that I've been able to find is this one, from a poem titled "St. Valentines day," in the [Springfield] Illinois Journal (February 16, 1852):
Then the second notion was, to save so much runnin / Arter the gals, which 'pays'—about as well as 'gunnin'— / Which don't pay at all, if you never tried it, take my word for it; / For, in my day, I've 'packed' a gun until I fairly abhor it.
I agree with KarlG's conclusion that "packing"—without "a gun," "a pistol," or "a weapon"—in the sense of carrying a firearm, and in particular a handgun—is a much later development. I suspect that his discovery of a 1970 instance of such usage will be hard to beat.
answered yesterday
Sven YargsSven Yargs
115k20251508
1
Green provides a 1962 citation to Yablonski, The Violent Gang (the link is to the 2009 edition, but I checked the 1962 edition and found the same uses; see pp. 100, 114, 122; contextual evidence suggests the uses were in the early 1950s for at least 'packed'--"Chino was 'packed.'"). Given the prevalence of anti-packing sentiment associated with "pistol-packing", "packing a gun", etc. in 1890s cities, it seems ill-advised to rule out elliptical uses such as are evidenced in Yablonski.
– JEL
yesterday
1
@JEL: The book is waitlisted so I can’t access it, but does the book cite the usage generally, or particular gang members. If the latter, were they African American? I'm wondering if the omission of object first occurred in AAVE.
– KarlG
yesterday
1
@JEL: Your point about elliptical use seems very reasonable—especially in a situation where some form of "packing a [weapon]" appears nearby. Two related modern usages (at least in the United States) involve "carrying" (money [1930s+], weapons [1930s+], or drugs [1940s+]) and "holding" (drugs [1930s+] or money [1930s+]). The dates are from Green, but they appear to involve use of the words unattached to an explicit object; as with "packing," forms of the expression that include an explicit object go back to the nineteenth century, Green says.
– Sven Yargs
yesterday
@KarlG, particular gang members are quoted, or paraphrased using their slang. About the members, I couldn't say what their backgrounds were; the gangs were mixed, reflecting the neighborhoods.
– JEL
20 hours ago
add a comment |
The earliest instance related to "packing a gun" that I've been able to find is this one, from a poem titled "St. Valentines day," in the [Springfield] Illinois Journal (February 16, 1852):
Then the second notion was, to save so much runnin / Arter the gals, which 'pays'—about as well as 'gunnin'— / Which don't pay at all, if you never tried it, take my word for it; / For, in my day, I've 'packed' a gun until I fairly abhor it.
I agree with KarlG's conclusion that "packing"—without "a gun," "a pistol," or "a weapon"—in the sense of carrying a firearm, and in particular a handgun—is a much later development. I suspect that his discovery of a 1970 instance of such usage will be hard to beat.
answered yesterday
Sven YargsSven Yargs
115k20251508
The earliest instance related to "packing a gun" that I've been able to find is this one, from a poem titled "St. Valentines day," in the [Springfield] Illinois Journal (February 16, 1852):
Then the second notion was, to save so much runnin / Arter the gals, which 'pays'—about as well as 'gunnin'— / Which don't pay at all, if you never tried it, take my word for it; / For, in my day, I've 'packed' a gun until I fairly abhor it.
I agree with KarlG's conclusion that "packing"—without "a gun," "a pistol," or "a weapon"—in the sense of carrying a firearm, and in particular a handgun—is a much later development. I suspect that his discovery of a 1970 instance of such usage will be hard to beat.
answered yesterday
Sven YargsSven Yargs
115k20251508
answered yesterday
Sven YargsSven Yargs
115k20251508
answered yesterday
Sven YargsSven Yargs
115k20251508
answered yesterday
Sven YargsSven Yargs
115k20251508
115k20251508
1
Green provides a 1962 citation to Yablonski, The Violent Gang (the link is to the 2009 edition, but I checked the 1962 edition and found the same uses; see pp. 100, 114, 122; contextual evidence suggests the uses were in the early 1950s for at least 'packed'--"Chino was 'packed.'"). Given the prevalence of anti-packing sentiment associated with "pistol-packing", "packing a gun", etc. in 1890s cities, it seems ill-advised to rule out elliptical uses such as are evidenced in Yablonski.
– JEL
yesterday
1
@JEL: The book is waitlisted so I can’t access it, but does the book cite the usage generally, or particular gang members. If the latter, were they African American? I'm wondering if the omission of object first occurred in AAVE.
– KarlG
yesterday
1
@JEL: Your point about elliptical use seems very reasonable—especially in a situation where some form of "packing a [weapon]" appears nearby. Two related modern usages (at least in the United States) involve "carrying" (money [1930s+], weapons [1930s+], or drugs [1940s+]) and "holding" (drugs [1930s+] or money [1930s+]). The dates are from Green, but they appear to involve use of the words unattached to an explicit object; as with "packing," forms of the expression that include an explicit object go back to the nineteenth century, Green says.
– Sven Yargs
yesterday
@KarlG, particular gang members are quoted, or paraphrased using their slang. About the members, I couldn't say what their backgrounds were; the gangs were mixed, reflecting the neighborhoods.
– JEL
20 hours ago
add a comment |
1
Green provides a 1962 citation to Yablonski, The Violent Gang (the link is to the 2009 edition, but I checked the 1962 edition and found the same uses; see pp. 100, 114, 122; contextual evidence suggests the uses were in the early 1950s for at least 'packed'--"Chino was 'packed.'"). Given the prevalence of anti-packing sentiment associated with "pistol-packing", "packing a gun", etc. in 1890s cities, it seems ill-advised to rule out elliptical uses such as are evidenced in Yablonski.
– JEL
yesterday
1
@JEL: The book is waitlisted so I can’t access it, but does the book cite the usage generally, or particular gang members. If the latter, were they African American? I'm wondering if the omission of object first occurred in AAVE.
– KarlG
yesterday
1
@JEL: Your point about elliptical use seems very reasonable—especially in a situation where some form of "packing a [weapon]" appears nearby. Two related modern usages (at least in the United States) involve "carrying" (money [1930s+], weapons [1930s+], or drugs [1940s+]) and "holding" (drugs [1930s+] or money [1930s+]). The dates are from Green, but they appear to involve use of the words unattached to an explicit object; as with "packing," forms of the expression that include an explicit object go back to the nineteenth century, Green says.
– Sven Yargs
yesterday
@KarlG, particular gang members are quoted, or paraphrased using their slang. About the members, I couldn't say what their backgrounds were; the gangs were mixed, reflecting the neighborhoods.
– JEL
20 hours ago
1
1
Green provides a 1962 citation to Yablonski, The Violent Gang (the link is to the 2009 edition, but I checked the 1962 edition and found the same uses; see pp. 100, 114, 122; contextual evidence suggests the uses were in the early 1950s for at least 'packed'--"Chino was 'packed.'"). Given the prevalence of anti-packing sentiment associated with "pistol-packing", "packing a gun", etc. in 1890s cities, it seems ill-advised to rule out elliptical uses such as are evidenced in Yablonski.
– JEL
yesterday
Green provides a 1962 citation to Yablonski, The Violent Gang (the link is to the 2009 edition, but I checked the 1962 edition and found the same uses; see pp. 100, 114, 122; contextual evidence suggests the uses were in the early 1950s for at least 'packed'--"Chino was 'packed.'"). Given the prevalence of anti-packing sentiment associated with "pistol-packing", "packing a gun", etc. in 1890s cities, it seems ill-advised to rule out elliptical uses such as are evidenced in Yablonski.
– JEL
yesterday
1
1
@JEL: The book is waitlisted so I can’t access it, but does the book cite the usage generally, or particular gang members. If the latter, were they African American? I'm wondering if the omission of object first occurred in AAVE.
– KarlG
yesterday
@JEL: The book is waitlisted so I can’t access it, but does the book cite the usage generally, or particular gang members. If the latter, were they African American? I'm wondering if the omission of object first occurred in AAVE.
– KarlG
yesterday
1
1
@JEL: Your point about elliptical use seems very reasonable—especially in a situation where some form of "packing a [weapon]" appears nearby. Two related modern usages (at least in the United States) involve "carrying" (money [1930s+], weapons [1930s+], or drugs [1940s+]) and "holding" (drugs [1930s+] or money [1930s+]). The dates are from Green, but they appear to involve use of the words unattached to an explicit object; as with "packing," forms of the expression that include an explicit object go back to the nineteenth century, Green says.
– Sven Yargs
yesterday
@JEL: Your point about elliptical use seems very reasonable—especially in a situation where some form of "packing a [weapon]" appears nearby. Two related modern usages (at least in the United States) involve "carrying" (money [1930s+], weapons [1930s+], or drugs [1940s+]) and "holding" (drugs [1930s+] or money [1930s+]). The dates are from Green, but they appear to involve use of the words unattached to an explicit object; as with "packing," forms of the expression that include an explicit object go back to the nineteenth century, Green says.
– Sven Yargs
yesterday
@KarlG, particular gang members are quoted, or paraphrased using their slang. About the members, I couldn't say what their backgrounds were; the gangs were mixed, reflecting the neighborhoods.
– JEL
20 hours ago
@KarlG, particular gang members are quoted, or paraphrased using their slang. About the members, I couldn't say what their backgrounds were; the gangs were mixed, reflecting the neighborhoods.
– JEL
20 hours ago
add a comment |
from Etymonline.com pack
Sense of "to carry or convey in a pack" (1805) led to general sense of
"to carry in any manner;" hence to pack heat "carry a gun,"
and OED
1865 Atlantic Monthly One of the best of Rosecrans's scouts..lost
his life because he would..‘pack’ (carry) his gun.
answered yesterday
lbflbf
22.4k22575
Where did you dig up the Atlantic Monthly quote? It didn’t show up in a COHA collocation search.
– KarlG
yesterday
You can find the entire October 1865 Atlantic quote here. Interestingly, the context involves a "scout" from eastern Kentucky working for the U.S. army who was found out by southern troops in the Confederate army because his dialect and habits differed from those of soldiers who really were from the mountains of Alabama, as he claimed to be.
– Sven Yargs
yesterday
1
Also of interest, from deposition taken March 19, 1869, from Andrew Hampton in Barnes vs. Adams: "Q. Did you never carry a gun, and go in company with Union soldiers ; and were you ever in the service as a soldier? — A. I have packed a gun to try to protect myself and my property, and to try to keep these men from stealing my property. I never was a soldier in any army."
– Sven Yargs
yesterday
add a comment |
from Etymonline.com pack
Sense of "to carry or convey in a pack" (1805) led to general sense of
"to carry in any manner;" hence to pack heat "carry a gun,"
and OED
1865 Atlantic Monthly One of the best of Rosecrans's scouts..lost
his life because he would..‘pack’ (carry) his gun.
answered yesterday
lbflbf
22.4k22575
Where did you dig up the Atlantic Monthly quote? It didn’t show up in a COHA collocation search.
– KarlG
yesterday
You can find the entire October 1865 Atlantic quote here. Interestingly, the context involves a "scout" from eastern Kentucky working for the U.S. army who was found out by southern troops in the Confederate army because his dialect and habits differed from those of soldiers who really were from the mountains of Alabama, as he claimed to be.
– Sven Yargs
yesterday
1
Also of interest, from deposition taken March 19, 1869, from Andrew Hampton in Barnes vs. Adams: "Q. Did you never carry a gun, and go in company with Union soldiers ; and were you ever in the service as a soldier? — A. I have packed a gun to try to protect myself and my property, and to try to keep these men from stealing my property. I never was a soldier in any army."
– Sven Yargs
yesterday
add a comment |
from Etymonline.com pack
Sense of "to carry or convey in a pack" (1805) led to general sense of
"to carry in any manner;" hence to pack heat "carry a gun,"
and OED
1865 Atlantic Monthly One of the best of Rosecrans's scouts..lost
his life because he would..‘pack’ (carry) his gun.
answered yesterday
lbflbf
22.4k22575
from Etymonline.com pack
Sense of "to carry or convey in a pack" (1805) led to general sense of
"to carry in any manner;" hence to pack heat "carry a gun,"
and OED
1865 Atlantic Monthly One of the best of Rosecrans's scouts..lost
his life because he would..‘pack’ (carry) his gun.
answered yesterday
lbflbf
22.4k22575
edited yesterday
answered yesterday
lbflbf
22.4k22575
answered yesterday
lbflbf
22.4k22575
answered yesterday
lbflbf
22.4k22575
22.4k22575
Where did you dig up the Atlantic Monthly quote? It didn’t show up in a COHA collocation search.
– KarlG
yesterday
You can find the entire October 1865 Atlantic quote here. Interestingly, the context involves a "scout" from eastern Kentucky working for the U.S. army who was found out by southern troops in the Confederate army because his dialect and habits differed from those of soldiers who really were from the mountains of Alabama, as he claimed to be.
– Sven Yargs
yesterday
1
Also of interest, from deposition taken March 19, 1869, from Andrew Hampton in Barnes vs. Adams: "Q. Did you never carry a gun, and go in company with Union soldiers ; and were you ever in the service as a soldier? — A. I have packed a gun to try to protect myself and my property, and to try to keep these men from stealing my property. I never was a soldier in any army."
– Sven Yargs
yesterday
add a comment |
Where did you dig up the Atlantic Monthly quote? It didn’t show up in a COHA collocation search.
– KarlG
yesterday
You can find the entire October 1865 Atlantic quote here. Interestingly, the context involves a "scout" from eastern Kentucky working for the U.S. army who was found out by southern troops in the Confederate army because his dialect and habits differed from those of soldiers who really were from the mountains of Alabama, as he claimed to be.
– Sven Yargs
yesterday
1
Also of interest, from deposition taken March 19, 1869, from Andrew Hampton in Barnes vs. Adams: "Q. Did you never carry a gun, and go in company with Union soldiers ; and were you ever in the service as a soldier? — A. I have packed a gun to try to protect myself and my property, and to try to keep these men from stealing my property. I never was a soldier in any army."
– Sven Yargs
yesterday
Where did you dig up the Atlantic Monthly quote? It didn’t show up in a COHA collocation search.
– KarlG
yesterday
Where did you dig up the Atlantic Monthly quote? It didn’t show up in a COHA collocation search.
– KarlG
yesterday
You can find the entire October 1865 Atlantic quote here. Interestingly, the context involves a "scout" from eastern Kentucky working for the U.S. army who was found out by southern troops in the Confederate army because his dialect and habits differed from those of soldiers who really were from the mountains of Alabama, as he claimed to be.
– Sven Yargs
yesterday
You can find the entire October 1865 Atlantic quote here. Interestingly, the context involves a "scout" from eastern Kentucky working for the U.S. army who was found out by southern troops in the Confederate army because his dialect and habits differed from those of soldiers who really were from the mountains of Alabama, as he claimed to be.
– Sven Yargs
yesterday
1
1
Also of interest, from deposition taken March 19, 1869, from Andrew Hampton in Barnes vs. Adams: "Q. Did you never carry a gun, and go in company with Union soldiers ; and were you ever in the service as a soldier? — A. I have packed a gun to try to protect myself and my property, and to try to keep these men from stealing my property. I never was a soldier in any army."
– Sven Yargs
yesterday
Also of interest, from deposition taken March 19, 1869, from Andrew Hampton in Barnes vs. Adams: "Q. Did you never carry a gun, and go in company with Union soldiers ; and were you ever in the service as a soldier? — A. I have packed a gun to try to protect myself and my property, and to try to keep these men from stealing my property. I never was a soldier in any army."
– Sven Yargs
yesterday
add a comment |
Packing meaning to carry a firearm is a shortened form of packing a gun/pistol etc., which emerges in the Western and Southwestern states and territories at least by the 1870s:
We should be glad to see William out of his troubles but he must quit “packing a pistol” and playing fighter. — Carson Daily Appeal (Carson City NV), 14 May 1873.
Q. The other men who came up, what did they come up for? —A. I didn’t see them until they got right up there.
Q. Did they have anything in their hands? —A. They were packing guns. — Modoc War, US House of Representatives, Message from the President [Grant], Washington DC, 1874.
The quotation marks around the phrase in the Nevada newspaper suggests a fairly new usage.
I suspect that the shortened form, i. e., with no direct object, is a late 20th c. innovation:
The brothers were packing, but that was not unusual; the Party was under surveillance at the time because of the fear of us starting trouble in Oakland after Dr. King's death … — Earl Anthony, Picking Up the Gun: a Report on the Black Panthers, 1970, 107.
Your friend is safe using pack a pistol etc., but it would be wise not to use the verb without a direct object for a narrative set in the late 19th c.
answered yesterday
KarlGKarlG
24k73567
add a comment |
Packing meaning to carry a firearm is a shortened form of packing a gun/pistol etc., which emerges in the Western and Southwestern states and territories at least by the 1870s:
We should be glad to see William out of his troubles but he must quit “packing a pistol” and playing fighter. — Carson Daily Appeal (Carson City NV), 14 May 1873.
Q. The other men who came up, what did they come up for? —A. I didn’t see them until they got right up there.
Q. Did they have anything in their hands? —A. They were packing guns. — Modoc War, US House of Representatives, Message from the President [Grant], Washington DC, 1874.
The quotation marks around the phrase in the Nevada newspaper suggests a fairly new usage.
I suspect that the shortened form, i. e., with no direct object, is a late 20th c. innovation:
The brothers were packing, but that was not unusual; the Party was under surveillance at the time because of the fear of us starting trouble in Oakland after Dr. King's death … — Earl Anthony, Picking Up the Gun: a Report on the Black Panthers, 1970, 107.
Your friend is safe using pack a pistol etc., but it would be wise not to use the verb without a direct object for a narrative set in the late 19th c.
answered yesterday
KarlGKarlG
24k73567
add a comment |
Packing meaning to carry a firearm is a shortened form of packing a gun/pistol etc., which emerges in the Western and Southwestern states and territories at least by the 1870s:
We should be glad to see William out of his troubles but he must quit “packing a pistol” and playing fighter. — Carson Daily Appeal (Carson City NV), 14 May 1873.
Q. The other men who came up, what did they come up for? —A. I didn’t see them until they got right up there.
Q. Did they have anything in their hands? —A. They were packing guns. — Modoc War, US House of Representatives, Message from the President [Grant], Washington DC, 1874.
The quotation marks around the phrase in the Nevada newspaper suggests a fairly new usage.
I suspect that the shortened form, i. e., with no direct object, is a late 20th c. innovation:
The brothers were packing, but that was not unusual; the Party was under surveillance at the time because of the fear of us starting trouble in Oakland after Dr. King's death … — Earl Anthony, Picking Up the Gun: a Report on the Black Panthers, 1970, 107.
Your friend is safe using pack a pistol etc., but it would be wise not to use the verb without a direct object for a narrative set in the late 19th c.
answered yesterday
KarlGKarlG
24k73567
Packing meaning to carry a firearm is a shortened form of packing a gun/pistol etc., which emerges in the Western and Southwestern states and territories at least by the 1870s:
We should be glad to see William out of his troubles but he must quit “packing a pistol” and playing fighter. — Carson Daily Appeal (Carson City NV), 14 May 1873.
Q. The other men who came up, what did they come up for? —A. I didn’t see them until they got right up there.
Q. Did they have anything in their hands? —A. They were packing guns. — Modoc War, US House of Representatives, Message from the President [Grant], Washington DC, 1874.
The quotation marks around the phrase in the Nevada newspaper suggests a fairly new usage.
I suspect that the shortened form, i. e., with no direct object, is a late 20th c. innovation:
The brothers were packing, but that was not unusual; the Party was under surveillance at the time because of the fear of us starting trouble in Oakland after Dr. King's death … — Earl Anthony, Picking Up the Gun: a Report on the Black Panthers, 1970, 107.
Your friend is safe using pack a pistol etc., but it would be wise not to use the verb without a direct object for a narrative set in the late 19th c.
answered yesterday
KarlGKarlG
24k73567
answered yesterday
KarlGKarlG
24k73567
answered yesterday
KarlGKarlG
24k73567
answered yesterday
KarlGKarlG
24k73567
24k73567
add a comment |
add a comment |
1898:
He passed in between his horse and that of his son's, "and got on the
west side of my son, and said to him: 'You are packing a gun for me,
and now, then, God damn you, use it' " At this, witness wheeled his
horse, and jumped off.
The Southwestern Reporter, June 27 -- August 22, 1898
Ngram finds one earlier use of "packing a gun", but it appears to refer to loading a cannon.
answered 2 days ago
Hot LicksHot Licks
19.5k23777
1
OP thinks that packing meaning "carrying a gun".
– Ubi hatt
2 days ago
1
@Ubihatt - And that is the sense that the above quote appears to be using.
– Hot Licks
2 days ago
1
I always thought it was just short for packing heat.
– KarlG
2 days ago
1
@KarlG yep! you are correct. Packing heat means carrying a gun.
– Ubi hatt
2 days ago
1
@Ubihatt - I don't understand. If you read the context (click on the link) the quote clearly refers to carrying a gun. "Packing heat" didn't enter the argot until the 1980s.
– Hot Licks
2 days ago
|
show 3 more comments
1898:
He passed in between his horse and that of his son's, "and got on the
west side of my son, and said to him: 'You are packing a gun for me,
and now, then, God damn you, use it' " At this, witness wheeled his
horse, and jumped off.
The Southwestern Reporter, June 27 -- August 22, 1898
Ngram finds one earlier use of "packing a gun", but it appears to refer to loading a cannon.
answered 2 days ago
Hot LicksHot Licks
19.5k23777
1
OP thinks that packing meaning "carrying a gun".
– Ubi hatt
2 days ago
1
@Ubihatt - And that is the sense that the above quote appears to be using.
– Hot Licks
2 days ago
1
I always thought it was just short for packing heat.
– KarlG
2 days ago
1
@KarlG yep! you are correct. Packing heat means carrying a gun.
– Ubi hatt
2 days ago
1
@Ubihatt - I don't understand. If you read the context (click on the link) the quote clearly refers to carrying a gun. "Packing heat" didn't enter the argot until the 1980s.
– Hot Licks
2 days ago
|
show 3 more comments
1898:
He passed in between his horse and that of his son's, "and got on the
west side of my son, and said to him: 'You are packing a gun for me,
and now, then, God damn you, use it' " At this, witness wheeled his
horse, and jumped off.
The Southwestern Reporter, June 27 -- August 22, 1898
Ngram finds one earlier use of "packing a gun", but it appears to refer to loading a cannon.
answered 2 days ago
Hot LicksHot Licks
19.5k23777
1898:
He passed in between his horse and that of his son's, "and got on the
west side of my son, and said to him: 'You are packing a gun for me,
and now, then, God damn you, use it' " At this, witness wheeled his
horse, and jumped off.
The Southwestern Reporter, June 27 -- August 22, 1898
Ngram finds one earlier use of "packing a gun", but it appears to refer to loading a cannon.
answered 2 days ago
Hot LicksHot Licks
19.5k23777
answered 2 days ago
Hot LicksHot Licks
19.5k23777
answered 2 days ago
Hot LicksHot Licks
19.5k23777
answered 2 days ago
Hot LicksHot Licks
19.5k23777
19.5k23777
1
OP thinks that packing meaning "carrying a gun".
– Ubi hatt
2 days ago
1
@Ubihatt - And that is the sense that the above quote appears to be using.
– Hot Licks
2 days ago
1
I always thought it was just short for packing heat.
– KarlG
2 days ago
1
@KarlG yep! you are correct. Packing heat means carrying a gun.
– Ubi hatt
2 days ago
1
@Ubihatt - I don't understand. If you read the context (click on the link) the quote clearly refers to carrying a gun. "Packing heat" didn't enter the argot until the 1980s.
– Hot Licks
2 days ago
|
show 3 more comments
1
OP thinks that packing meaning "carrying a gun".
– Ubi hatt
2 days ago
1
@Ubihatt - And that is the sense that the above quote appears to be using.
– Hot Licks
2 days ago
1
I always thought it was just short for packing heat.
– KarlG
2 days ago
1
@KarlG yep! you are correct. Packing heat means carrying a gun.
– Ubi hatt
2 days ago
1
@Ubihatt - I don't understand. If you read the context (click on the link) the quote clearly refers to carrying a gun. "Packing heat" didn't enter the argot until the 1980s.
– Hot Licks
2 days ago
1
1
OP thinks that packing meaning "carrying a gun".
– Ubi hatt
2 days ago
OP thinks that packing meaning "carrying a gun".
– Ubi hatt
2 days ago
1
1
@Ubihatt - And that is the sense that the above quote appears to be using.
– Hot Licks
2 days ago
@Ubihatt - And that is the sense that the above quote appears to be using.
– Hot Licks
2 days ago
1
1
I always thought it was just short for packing heat.
– KarlG
2 days ago
I always thought it was just short for packing heat.
– KarlG
2 days ago
1
1
@KarlG yep! you are correct. Packing heat means carrying a gun.
– Ubi hatt
2 days ago
@KarlG yep! you are correct. Packing heat means carrying a gun.
– Ubi hatt
2 days ago
1
1
@Ubihatt - I don't understand. If you read the context (click on the link) the quote clearly refers to carrying a gun. "Packing heat" didn't enter the argot until the 1980s.
– Hot Licks
2 days ago
@Ubihatt - I don't understand. If you read the context (click on the link) the quote clearly refers to carrying a gun. "Packing heat" didn't enter the argot until the 1980s.
– Hot Licks
2 days ago
|
show 3 more comments
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1
Possible duplicate of What does “packing heat” mean?
– Ubi hatt
2 days ago
Thanks for the question. Without more context, any answer needs qualification. For example, "The pack horses had to be left outside of town while the men went on in. Nobody was packing there." gives one context for your friend's sentence, but "In Carson City [in the 1890s] men packing a pistol were hung for being dangerous cowards. Nobody was packing there." gives quite another. Neither use would be anachronistic in a historical novel set in the 1890s.
– JEL
yesterday
Note also that in the 1890s another idiom was in use: 'packing a [weapon] for [somebody]' meant that the weapon was being carryed for the purpose or with the intent of using it on the indirect object (somebody). The weapon involved was generally a knife or gun.
– JEL
yesterday
It may be worth comparing to "packs a punch", which seems to have been newish in 1912, where it appears in scare quotes. books.google.com/books/…
– Phil Sweet
yesterday