Equivalent of “both” when referring to three or more items?












59















What would be the correct word to use when referring to three or more items, in the same manner as the word both?



For example, using two words, with the word both:




"There are several recommendations I
have to further improve the sites —
both to improve their profit, and
decrease their cost."




Using three words, with a blank space in place of the correct word:




"There are several recommendations I
have to further improve the sites —
_ to improve their profit, decrease their cost and improve their
usability."




So, what would be the correct word to use in place of the __?










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  • 1





    What about "threeoth"? A is good, both in X and in Y. B is good, threeoth in X, in Y, and in Z.

    – Pacerier
    Mar 29 '16 at 14:40













  • Related: english.stackexchange.com/questions/337595/…

    – SAH
    Feb 26 '17 at 18:10











  • Oh man, "throth" (my spelling), that's hilarious. I really wish there were special cases where "both" works for three items. For example, "Both Kate as producer, Jim as director, and Ted as lead actor did a phenomenal job." That sentence just seems to want to start with an inclusive word like "both" there, and seems like a "cheat" that we actually use when speaking. Oh well.

    – bwperrin
    Sep 8 '17 at 16:25


















59















What would be the correct word to use when referring to three or more items, in the same manner as the word both?



For example, using two words, with the word both:




"There are several recommendations I
have to further improve the sites —
both to improve their profit, and
decrease their cost."




Using three words, with a blank space in place of the correct word:




"There are several recommendations I
have to further improve the sites —
_ to improve their profit, decrease their cost and improve their
usability."




So, what would be the correct word to use in place of the __?










share|improve this question




















  • 1





    What about "threeoth"? A is good, both in X and in Y. B is good, threeoth in X, in Y, and in Z.

    – Pacerier
    Mar 29 '16 at 14:40













  • Related: english.stackexchange.com/questions/337595/…

    – SAH
    Feb 26 '17 at 18:10











  • Oh man, "throth" (my spelling), that's hilarious. I really wish there were special cases where "both" works for three items. For example, "Both Kate as producer, Jim as director, and Ted as lead actor did a phenomenal job." That sentence just seems to want to start with an inclusive word like "both" there, and seems like a "cheat" that we actually use when speaking. Oh well.

    – bwperrin
    Sep 8 '17 at 16:25
















59












59








59


11






What would be the correct word to use when referring to three or more items, in the same manner as the word both?



For example, using two words, with the word both:




"There are several recommendations I
have to further improve the sites —
both to improve their profit, and
decrease their cost."




Using three words, with a blank space in place of the correct word:




"There are several recommendations I
have to further improve the sites —
_ to improve their profit, decrease their cost and improve their
usability."




So, what would be the correct word to use in place of the __?










share|improve this question
















What would be the correct word to use when referring to three or more items, in the same manner as the word both?



For example, using two words, with the word both:




"There are several recommendations I
have to further improve the sites —
both to improve their profit, and
decrease their cost."




Using three words, with a blank space in place of the correct word:




"There are several recommendations I
have to further improve the sites —
_ to improve their profit, decrease their cost and improve their
usability."




So, what would be the correct word to use in place of the __?







word-choice single-word-requests determiners correlative-conjunctions






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share|improve this question













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edited Aug 14 '14 at 16:51









tchrist

109k28290464




109k28290464










asked Apr 23 '11 at 23:22









WipqoznWipqozn

4772617




4772617








  • 1





    What about "threeoth"? A is good, both in X and in Y. B is good, threeoth in X, in Y, and in Z.

    – Pacerier
    Mar 29 '16 at 14:40













  • Related: english.stackexchange.com/questions/337595/…

    – SAH
    Feb 26 '17 at 18:10











  • Oh man, "throth" (my spelling), that's hilarious. I really wish there were special cases where "both" works for three items. For example, "Both Kate as producer, Jim as director, and Ted as lead actor did a phenomenal job." That sentence just seems to want to start with an inclusive word like "both" there, and seems like a "cheat" that we actually use when speaking. Oh well.

    – bwperrin
    Sep 8 '17 at 16:25
















  • 1





    What about "threeoth"? A is good, both in X and in Y. B is good, threeoth in X, in Y, and in Z.

    – Pacerier
    Mar 29 '16 at 14:40













  • Related: english.stackexchange.com/questions/337595/…

    – SAH
    Feb 26 '17 at 18:10











  • Oh man, "throth" (my spelling), that's hilarious. I really wish there were special cases where "both" works for three items. For example, "Both Kate as producer, Jim as director, and Ted as lead actor did a phenomenal job." That sentence just seems to want to start with an inclusive word like "both" there, and seems like a "cheat" that we actually use when speaking. Oh well.

    – bwperrin
    Sep 8 '17 at 16:25










1




1





What about "threeoth"? A is good, both in X and in Y. B is good, threeoth in X, in Y, and in Z.

– Pacerier
Mar 29 '16 at 14:40







What about "threeoth"? A is good, both in X and in Y. B is good, threeoth in X, in Y, and in Z.

– Pacerier
Mar 29 '16 at 14:40















Related: english.stackexchange.com/questions/337595/…

– SAH
Feb 26 '17 at 18:10





Related: english.stackexchange.com/questions/337595/…

– SAH
Feb 26 '17 at 18:10













Oh man, "throth" (my spelling), that's hilarious. I really wish there were special cases where "both" works for three items. For example, "Both Kate as producer, Jim as director, and Ted as lead actor did a phenomenal job." That sentence just seems to want to start with an inclusive word like "both" there, and seems like a "cheat" that we actually use when speaking. Oh well.

– bwperrin
Sep 8 '17 at 16:25







Oh man, "throth" (my spelling), that's hilarious. I really wish there were special cases where "both" works for three items. For example, "Both Kate as producer, Jim as director, and Ted as lead actor did a phenomenal job." That sentence just seems to want to start with an inclusive word like "both" there, and seems like a "cheat" that we actually use when speaking. Oh well.

– bwperrin
Sep 8 '17 at 16:25












9 Answers
9






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24














At that point I'd probably pick out one of the list for special attention using "not only ... but":




There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites, not only to improve their profit, but to decrease their cost and improve their usability.




I'd cut that down further, though:




I have several recommendations to improve the sites — not only to improve their profit, but to decrease their cost and improve their usability.







share|improve this answer
























  • as well as, as an alternative to not only ... but, is an option for putting less "special attention" on the first pick. Furthermore you could leave out a conjunction, resulting in no special attention: "There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites, aiming to improve their profit, decrease their cost and improve their usability."

    – Aaron Thoma
    Apr 6 '15 at 6:59



















22














Both is the suppletive variant of *all two, which is not grammatical English.




Suppletion is the irregular grammatical phenomenon of substituting a different word or root.

Like using went instead of *goed, or ever instead of *anywhen. It's not too common in English, but it occurs.




So the equivalent of both, for N> 2, is All N: all three, all four, all seventy-seven of them.






share|improve this answer





















  • 2





    Interesting, thanks! Unfortunately that doesn't seem to me to be usable either, as "There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites — all three to improve their profit, decrease their cost and improve their usability." sounds like the "three" counts the recommendations.

    – Aaron Thoma
    Apr 6 '15 at 5:49






  • 1





    That sentence is attempting to call the correlative conjunction both...and to ternary duty, but it doesn't work that way. Both alone is 'all two', but both...and is a unit and depends on binary structure, especially with infinitives. Different adaptation, different rules; if words were Galapagos finches, the both in both...and would have a different size bill from the lone quantifier both.

    – John Lawler
    Apr 6 '15 at 14:06











  • @JohnLawler: I'm curious about the stance linguists take with respect to extra-grammaticality and clear expression. For example, "Why don't you go and ask your supporters, all two of them?" [or even all one of them] is a perfectly valid use of extra-grammatical English to convey a precise meaning, although one that may stubbornly exist only outside the finite wavelength of grammatical expression.

    – Robusto
    Aug 21 '16 at 23:30











  • Of course it's possible. And we understand it because of the pattern and because of its variance from it. Like a harmonic for a musical note, or a sideband for a radio signal. Grammatical patterns are just the baseline that everything varies from; the variations are a big part of the language. They're what sociolinguistics and historical linguistics are all about.

    – John Lawler
    Aug 22 '16 at 2:23





















10














I would leave out the word altogether, the second example you give makes perfect sense as it stands:



There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites; to improve their profit, decrease their cost and improve their usability.


Or, if I'm going to be really picky, and remove the doubling up of the phrase "improve":



There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites' profit, decrease their costs and improve their usability.





share|improve this answer



















  • 1





    I disagree a bit with your first proposition where you just left the blank blank ("There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites; to improve their profit, decrease their cost and improve their usability."): I find that could be misunderstood as the 3 phrases ("to improve their profit" etc.) being the recommendations (while actually the 3 phrases are the supposed advantageous effects of an undetermined number of recommendations).

    – Aaron Thoma
    Apr 6 '15 at 5:44



















3














You don't need a word there at all.




There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites — to improve their profitability, decrease their cost and improve their usability.




A follow-up suggestion, which you didn't ask for, is to remove the triple repetition of the word "improve".




I propose several recommendations for the sites to raise their profitability, cut their cost, and improve their usability.




Furthermore, a cost decrease generally implies a profit increase, so that may be redundant.




I propose several recommendations for the sites to improve both their profitability and their usability.







share|improve this answer































    3














    You could try a combination of "both" and "as well as".




    "There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites — both to improve their profit and decrease their cost, as well as improve their usability."




    Although, this might put an emphasis on the last point.






    share|improve this answer































      3














      There are two usual alternatives to refer to the three items:




      1. "not only...., but...and..."

      2. "both...and...as well as..."


      The first alternative - "not only..., but...and..." - has a limitation: it is basically intended to refer to two items, but is adapted to fit in three items by adding "and...". Moreover, "not only..." puts less emphasis on the first item.



      The second alternative - "both...and...as well as..." - puts an emphasis on the last item.



      Therefore, the best way to refer to three items is to use "...: firstly...; secondly...; lastly...". In the instant case, the sentence could be written as follows:



      "There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites: firstly, to improve their profit; secondly, to decrease their cost; lastly, to improve their usability."





      share|improve this answer

































        2














        Logically, you don't have "several" recommendations, but "three".




        There are three recommendations I have to further improve the sites - to improve their profit, decrease their cost and improve their usability.




        Cheers






        share|improve this answer



















        • 2





          No, improving profit is probably not a recommendation, but a supposed advantage of their unspecified (and not numbered) recommendations. Otherwise, that would be akin to proposing as a business idea: "Let's earn more money!"… ;)

          – Aaron Thoma
          Apr 6 '15 at 5:56



















        0














        Consider triad




        A grouping of three.




        https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/triad






        share|improve this answer































          0














          I ran into a somewhat similar situation recently where I was tempted to use "both" in reference to three items, as in:




          I did see a notable increase in my approach frequency when placed into a rare situation in my city where there was both high traffic overall, a high fraction of the target demographic, and conditions favourable to approaching.




          For this case, I found that "together" did the trick nicely:




          I did see a notable increase in my approach frequency when placed into a rare situation in my city where there was together high traffic overall, a high fraction of the target demographic, and conditions favourable to approaching.




          This doesn't work quite as nicely in your particular example, but I thought I'd mention it since it works well in some cases.



          It does work for your example also, just not quite as nicely:




          There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites — together to improve their profit, decrease their cost and improve their usability.




          However, for your example, some of the other suggestions, such as simply removing the conjunction altogether, are probably just as well. "Together" was more crucial to my example because the simultaneity of the factors was more significant to the meaning of the sentence.






          share|improve this answer






















            protected by tchrist Aug 13 '14 at 14:39



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            9 Answers
            9






            active

            oldest

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            9 Answers
            9






            active

            oldest

            votes









            active

            oldest

            votes






            active

            oldest

            votes









            24














            At that point I'd probably pick out one of the list for special attention using "not only ... but":




            There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites, not only to improve their profit, but to decrease their cost and improve their usability.




            I'd cut that down further, though:




            I have several recommendations to improve the sites — not only to improve their profit, but to decrease their cost and improve their usability.







            share|improve this answer
























            • as well as, as an alternative to not only ... but, is an option for putting less "special attention" on the first pick. Furthermore you could leave out a conjunction, resulting in no special attention: "There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites, aiming to improve their profit, decrease their cost and improve their usability."

              – Aaron Thoma
              Apr 6 '15 at 6:59
















            24














            At that point I'd probably pick out one of the list for special attention using "not only ... but":




            There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites, not only to improve their profit, but to decrease their cost and improve their usability.




            I'd cut that down further, though:




            I have several recommendations to improve the sites — not only to improve their profit, but to decrease their cost and improve their usability.







            share|improve this answer
























            • as well as, as an alternative to not only ... but, is an option for putting less "special attention" on the first pick. Furthermore you could leave out a conjunction, resulting in no special attention: "There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites, aiming to improve their profit, decrease their cost and improve their usability."

              – Aaron Thoma
              Apr 6 '15 at 6:59














            24












            24








            24







            At that point I'd probably pick out one of the list for special attention using "not only ... but":




            There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites, not only to improve their profit, but to decrease their cost and improve their usability.




            I'd cut that down further, though:




            I have several recommendations to improve the sites — not only to improve their profit, but to decrease their cost and improve their usability.







            share|improve this answer













            At that point I'd probably pick out one of the list for special attention using "not only ... but":




            There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites, not only to improve their profit, but to decrease their cost and improve their usability.




            I'd cut that down further, though:




            I have several recommendations to improve the sites — not only to improve their profit, but to decrease their cost and improve their usability.








            share|improve this answer












            share|improve this answer



            share|improve this answer










            answered Apr 24 '11 at 0:21









            RobustoRobusto

            128k28303515




            128k28303515













            • as well as, as an alternative to not only ... but, is an option for putting less "special attention" on the first pick. Furthermore you could leave out a conjunction, resulting in no special attention: "There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites, aiming to improve their profit, decrease their cost and improve their usability."

              – Aaron Thoma
              Apr 6 '15 at 6:59



















            • as well as, as an alternative to not only ... but, is an option for putting less "special attention" on the first pick. Furthermore you could leave out a conjunction, resulting in no special attention: "There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites, aiming to improve their profit, decrease their cost and improve their usability."

              – Aaron Thoma
              Apr 6 '15 at 6:59

















            as well as, as an alternative to not only ... but, is an option for putting less "special attention" on the first pick. Furthermore you could leave out a conjunction, resulting in no special attention: "There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites, aiming to improve their profit, decrease their cost and improve their usability."

            – Aaron Thoma
            Apr 6 '15 at 6:59





            as well as, as an alternative to not only ... but, is an option for putting less "special attention" on the first pick. Furthermore you could leave out a conjunction, resulting in no special attention: "There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites, aiming to improve their profit, decrease their cost and improve their usability."

            – Aaron Thoma
            Apr 6 '15 at 6:59













            22














            Both is the suppletive variant of *all two, which is not grammatical English.




            Suppletion is the irregular grammatical phenomenon of substituting a different word or root.

            Like using went instead of *goed, or ever instead of *anywhen. It's not too common in English, but it occurs.




            So the equivalent of both, for N> 2, is All N: all three, all four, all seventy-seven of them.






            share|improve this answer





















            • 2





              Interesting, thanks! Unfortunately that doesn't seem to me to be usable either, as "There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites — all three to improve their profit, decrease their cost and improve their usability." sounds like the "three" counts the recommendations.

              – Aaron Thoma
              Apr 6 '15 at 5:49






            • 1





              That sentence is attempting to call the correlative conjunction both...and to ternary duty, but it doesn't work that way. Both alone is 'all two', but both...and is a unit and depends on binary structure, especially with infinitives. Different adaptation, different rules; if words were Galapagos finches, the both in both...and would have a different size bill from the lone quantifier both.

              – John Lawler
              Apr 6 '15 at 14:06











            • @JohnLawler: I'm curious about the stance linguists take with respect to extra-grammaticality and clear expression. For example, "Why don't you go and ask your supporters, all two of them?" [or even all one of them] is a perfectly valid use of extra-grammatical English to convey a precise meaning, although one that may stubbornly exist only outside the finite wavelength of grammatical expression.

              – Robusto
              Aug 21 '16 at 23:30











            • Of course it's possible. And we understand it because of the pattern and because of its variance from it. Like a harmonic for a musical note, or a sideband for a radio signal. Grammatical patterns are just the baseline that everything varies from; the variations are a big part of the language. They're what sociolinguistics and historical linguistics are all about.

              – John Lawler
              Aug 22 '16 at 2:23


















            22














            Both is the suppletive variant of *all two, which is not grammatical English.




            Suppletion is the irregular grammatical phenomenon of substituting a different word or root.

            Like using went instead of *goed, or ever instead of *anywhen. It's not too common in English, but it occurs.




            So the equivalent of both, for N> 2, is All N: all three, all four, all seventy-seven of them.






            share|improve this answer





















            • 2





              Interesting, thanks! Unfortunately that doesn't seem to me to be usable either, as "There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites — all three to improve their profit, decrease their cost and improve their usability." sounds like the "three" counts the recommendations.

              – Aaron Thoma
              Apr 6 '15 at 5:49






            • 1





              That sentence is attempting to call the correlative conjunction both...and to ternary duty, but it doesn't work that way. Both alone is 'all two', but both...and is a unit and depends on binary structure, especially with infinitives. Different adaptation, different rules; if words were Galapagos finches, the both in both...and would have a different size bill from the lone quantifier both.

              – John Lawler
              Apr 6 '15 at 14:06











            • @JohnLawler: I'm curious about the stance linguists take with respect to extra-grammaticality and clear expression. For example, "Why don't you go and ask your supporters, all two of them?" [or even all one of them] is a perfectly valid use of extra-grammatical English to convey a precise meaning, although one that may stubbornly exist only outside the finite wavelength of grammatical expression.

              – Robusto
              Aug 21 '16 at 23:30











            • Of course it's possible. And we understand it because of the pattern and because of its variance from it. Like a harmonic for a musical note, or a sideband for a radio signal. Grammatical patterns are just the baseline that everything varies from; the variations are a big part of the language. They're what sociolinguistics and historical linguistics are all about.

              – John Lawler
              Aug 22 '16 at 2:23
















            22












            22








            22







            Both is the suppletive variant of *all two, which is not grammatical English.




            Suppletion is the irregular grammatical phenomenon of substituting a different word or root.

            Like using went instead of *goed, or ever instead of *anywhen. It's not too common in English, but it occurs.




            So the equivalent of both, for N> 2, is All N: all three, all four, all seventy-seven of them.






            share|improve this answer















            Both is the suppletive variant of *all two, which is not grammatical English.




            Suppletion is the irregular grammatical phenomenon of substituting a different word or root.

            Like using went instead of *goed, or ever instead of *anywhen. It's not too common in English, but it occurs.




            So the equivalent of both, for N> 2, is All N: all three, all four, all seventy-seven of them.







            share|improve this answer














            share|improve this answer



            share|improve this answer








            edited Jul 3 '16 at 19:09

























            answered Jul 31 '14 at 13:47









            John LawlerJohn Lawler

            84.3k6116330




            84.3k6116330








            • 2





              Interesting, thanks! Unfortunately that doesn't seem to me to be usable either, as "There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites — all three to improve their profit, decrease their cost and improve their usability." sounds like the "three" counts the recommendations.

              – Aaron Thoma
              Apr 6 '15 at 5:49






            • 1





              That sentence is attempting to call the correlative conjunction both...and to ternary duty, but it doesn't work that way. Both alone is 'all two', but both...and is a unit and depends on binary structure, especially with infinitives. Different adaptation, different rules; if words were Galapagos finches, the both in both...and would have a different size bill from the lone quantifier both.

              – John Lawler
              Apr 6 '15 at 14:06











            • @JohnLawler: I'm curious about the stance linguists take with respect to extra-grammaticality and clear expression. For example, "Why don't you go and ask your supporters, all two of them?" [or even all one of them] is a perfectly valid use of extra-grammatical English to convey a precise meaning, although one that may stubbornly exist only outside the finite wavelength of grammatical expression.

              – Robusto
              Aug 21 '16 at 23:30











            • Of course it's possible. And we understand it because of the pattern and because of its variance from it. Like a harmonic for a musical note, or a sideband for a radio signal. Grammatical patterns are just the baseline that everything varies from; the variations are a big part of the language. They're what sociolinguistics and historical linguistics are all about.

              – John Lawler
              Aug 22 '16 at 2:23
















            • 2





              Interesting, thanks! Unfortunately that doesn't seem to me to be usable either, as "There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites — all three to improve their profit, decrease their cost and improve their usability." sounds like the "three" counts the recommendations.

              – Aaron Thoma
              Apr 6 '15 at 5:49






            • 1





              That sentence is attempting to call the correlative conjunction both...and to ternary duty, but it doesn't work that way. Both alone is 'all two', but both...and is a unit and depends on binary structure, especially with infinitives. Different adaptation, different rules; if words were Galapagos finches, the both in both...and would have a different size bill from the lone quantifier both.

              – John Lawler
              Apr 6 '15 at 14:06











            • @JohnLawler: I'm curious about the stance linguists take with respect to extra-grammaticality and clear expression. For example, "Why don't you go and ask your supporters, all two of them?" [or even all one of them] is a perfectly valid use of extra-grammatical English to convey a precise meaning, although one that may stubbornly exist only outside the finite wavelength of grammatical expression.

              – Robusto
              Aug 21 '16 at 23:30











            • Of course it's possible. And we understand it because of the pattern and because of its variance from it. Like a harmonic for a musical note, or a sideband for a radio signal. Grammatical patterns are just the baseline that everything varies from; the variations are a big part of the language. They're what sociolinguistics and historical linguistics are all about.

              – John Lawler
              Aug 22 '16 at 2:23










            2




            2





            Interesting, thanks! Unfortunately that doesn't seem to me to be usable either, as "There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites — all three to improve their profit, decrease their cost and improve their usability." sounds like the "three" counts the recommendations.

            – Aaron Thoma
            Apr 6 '15 at 5:49





            Interesting, thanks! Unfortunately that doesn't seem to me to be usable either, as "There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites — all three to improve their profit, decrease their cost and improve their usability." sounds like the "three" counts the recommendations.

            – Aaron Thoma
            Apr 6 '15 at 5:49




            1




            1





            That sentence is attempting to call the correlative conjunction both...and to ternary duty, but it doesn't work that way. Both alone is 'all two', but both...and is a unit and depends on binary structure, especially with infinitives. Different adaptation, different rules; if words were Galapagos finches, the both in both...and would have a different size bill from the lone quantifier both.

            – John Lawler
            Apr 6 '15 at 14:06





            That sentence is attempting to call the correlative conjunction both...and to ternary duty, but it doesn't work that way. Both alone is 'all two', but both...and is a unit and depends on binary structure, especially with infinitives. Different adaptation, different rules; if words were Galapagos finches, the both in both...and would have a different size bill from the lone quantifier both.

            – John Lawler
            Apr 6 '15 at 14:06













            @JohnLawler: I'm curious about the stance linguists take with respect to extra-grammaticality and clear expression. For example, "Why don't you go and ask your supporters, all two of them?" [or even all one of them] is a perfectly valid use of extra-grammatical English to convey a precise meaning, although one that may stubbornly exist only outside the finite wavelength of grammatical expression.

            – Robusto
            Aug 21 '16 at 23:30





            @JohnLawler: I'm curious about the stance linguists take with respect to extra-grammaticality and clear expression. For example, "Why don't you go and ask your supporters, all two of them?" [or even all one of them] is a perfectly valid use of extra-grammatical English to convey a precise meaning, although one that may stubbornly exist only outside the finite wavelength of grammatical expression.

            – Robusto
            Aug 21 '16 at 23:30













            Of course it's possible. And we understand it because of the pattern and because of its variance from it. Like a harmonic for a musical note, or a sideband for a radio signal. Grammatical patterns are just the baseline that everything varies from; the variations are a big part of the language. They're what sociolinguistics and historical linguistics are all about.

            – John Lawler
            Aug 22 '16 at 2:23







            Of course it's possible. And we understand it because of the pattern and because of its variance from it. Like a harmonic for a musical note, or a sideband for a radio signal. Grammatical patterns are just the baseline that everything varies from; the variations are a big part of the language. They're what sociolinguistics and historical linguistics are all about.

            – John Lawler
            Aug 22 '16 at 2:23













            10














            I would leave out the word altogether, the second example you give makes perfect sense as it stands:



            There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites; to improve their profit, decrease their cost and improve their usability.


            Or, if I'm going to be really picky, and remove the doubling up of the phrase "improve":



            There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites' profit, decrease their costs and improve their usability.





            share|improve this answer



















            • 1





              I disagree a bit with your first proposition where you just left the blank blank ("There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites; to improve their profit, decrease their cost and improve their usability."): I find that could be misunderstood as the 3 phrases ("to improve their profit" etc.) being the recommendations (while actually the 3 phrases are the supposed advantageous effects of an undetermined number of recommendations).

              – Aaron Thoma
              Apr 6 '15 at 5:44
















            10














            I would leave out the word altogether, the second example you give makes perfect sense as it stands:



            There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites; to improve their profit, decrease their cost and improve their usability.


            Or, if I'm going to be really picky, and remove the doubling up of the phrase "improve":



            There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites' profit, decrease their costs and improve their usability.





            share|improve this answer



















            • 1





              I disagree a bit with your first proposition where you just left the blank blank ("There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites; to improve their profit, decrease their cost and improve their usability."): I find that could be misunderstood as the 3 phrases ("to improve their profit" etc.) being the recommendations (while actually the 3 phrases are the supposed advantageous effects of an undetermined number of recommendations).

              – Aaron Thoma
              Apr 6 '15 at 5:44














            10












            10








            10







            I would leave out the word altogether, the second example you give makes perfect sense as it stands:



            There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites; to improve their profit, decrease their cost and improve their usability.


            Or, if I'm going to be really picky, and remove the doubling up of the phrase "improve":



            There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites' profit, decrease their costs and improve their usability.





            share|improve this answer













            I would leave out the word altogether, the second example you give makes perfect sense as it stands:



            There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites; to improve their profit, decrease their cost and improve their usability.


            Or, if I'm going to be really picky, and remove the doubling up of the phrase "improve":



            There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites' profit, decrease their costs and improve their usability.






            share|improve this answer












            share|improve this answer



            share|improve this answer










            answered Apr 24 '11 at 1:00









            LoquacityLoquacity

            1,9101112




            1,9101112








            • 1





              I disagree a bit with your first proposition where you just left the blank blank ("There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites; to improve their profit, decrease their cost and improve their usability."): I find that could be misunderstood as the 3 phrases ("to improve their profit" etc.) being the recommendations (while actually the 3 phrases are the supposed advantageous effects of an undetermined number of recommendations).

              – Aaron Thoma
              Apr 6 '15 at 5:44














            • 1





              I disagree a bit with your first proposition where you just left the blank blank ("There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites; to improve their profit, decrease their cost and improve their usability."): I find that could be misunderstood as the 3 phrases ("to improve their profit" etc.) being the recommendations (while actually the 3 phrases are the supposed advantageous effects of an undetermined number of recommendations).

              – Aaron Thoma
              Apr 6 '15 at 5:44








            1




            1





            I disagree a bit with your first proposition where you just left the blank blank ("There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites; to improve their profit, decrease their cost and improve their usability."): I find that could be misunderstood as the 3 phrases ("to improve their profit" etc.) being the recommendations (while actually the 3 phrases are the supposed advantageous effects of an undetermined number of recommendations).

            – Aaron Thoma
            Apr 6 '15 at 5:44





            I disagree a bit with your first proposition where you just left the blank blank ("There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites; to improve their profit, decrease their cost and improve their usability."): I find that could be misunderstood as the 3 phrases ("to improve their profit" etc.) being the recommendations (while actually the 3 phrases are the supposed advantageous effects of an undetermined number of recommendations).

            – Aaron Thoma
            Apr 6 '15 at 5:44











            3














            You don't need a word there at all.




            There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites — to improve their profitability, decrease their cost and improve their usability.




            A follow-up suggestion, which you didn't ask for, is to remove the triple repetition of the word "improve".




            I propose several recommendations for the sites to raise their profitability, cut their cost, and improve their usability.




            Furthermore, a cost decrease generally implies a profit increase, so that may be redundant.




            I propose several recommendations for the sites to improve both their profitability and their usability.







            share|improve this answer




























              3














              You don't need a word there at all.




              There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites — to improve their profitability, decrease their cost and improve their usability.




              A follow-up suggestion, which you didn't ask for, is to remove the triple repetition of the word "improve".




              I propose several recommendations for the sites to raise their profitability, cut their cost, and improve their usability.




              Furthermore, a cost decrease generally implies a profit increase, so that may be redundant.




              I propose several recommendations for the sites to improve both their profitability and their usability.







              share|improve this answer


























                3












                3








                3







                You don't need a word there at all.




                There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites — to improve their profitability, decrease their cost and improve their usability.




                A follow-up suggestion, which you didn't ask for, is to remove the triple repetition of the word "improve".




                I propose several recommendations for the sites to raise their profitability, cut their cost, and improve their usability.




                Furthermore, a cost decrease generally implies a profit increase, so that may be redundant.




                I propose several recommendations for the sites to improve both their profitability and their usability.







                share|improve this answer













                You don't need a word there at all.




                There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites — to improve their profitability, decrease their cost and improve their usability.




                A follow-up suggestion, which you didn't ask for, is to remove the triple repetition of the word "improve".




                I propose several recommendations for the sites to raise their profitability, cut their cost, and improve their usability.




                Furthermore, a cost decrease generally implies a profit increase, so that may be redundant.




                I propose several recommendations for the sites to improve both their profitability and their usability.








                share|improve this answer












                share|improve this answer



                share|improve this answer










                answered Jul 9 '12 at 23:55









                200_success200_success

                6,45112751




                6,45112751























                    3














                    You could try a combination of "both" and "as well as".




                    "There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites — both to improve their profit and decrease their cost, as well as improve their usability."




                    Although, this might put an emphasis on the last point.






                    share|improve this answer




























                      3














                      You could try a combination of "both" and "as well as".




                      "There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites — both to improve their profit and decrease their cost, as well as improve their usability."




                      Although, this might put an emphasis on the last point.






                      share|improve this answer


























                        3












                        3








                        3







                        You could try a combination of "both" and "as well as".




                        "There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites — both to improve their profit and decrease their cost, as well as improve their usability."




                        Although, this might put an emphasis on the last point.






                        share|improve this answer













                        You could try a combination of "both" and "as well as".




                        "There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites — both to improve their profit and decrease their cost, as well as improve their usability."




                        Although, this might put an emphasis on the last point.







                        share|improve this answer












                        share|improve this answer



                        share|improve this answer










                        answered Apr 21 '15 at 17:35









                        Lu KasLu Kas

                        5316




                        5316























                            3














                            There are two usual alternatives to refer to the three items:




                            1. "not only...., but...and..."

                            2. "both...and...as well as..."


                            The first alternative - "not only..., but...and..." - has a limitation: it is basically intended to refer to two items, but is adapted to fit in three items by adding "and...". Moreover, "not only..." puts less emphasis on the first item.



                            The second alternative - "both...and...as well as..." - puts an emphasis on the last item.



                            Therefore, the best way to refer to three items is to use "...: firstly...; secondly...; lastly...". In the instant case, the sentence could be written as follows:



                            "There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites: firstly, to improve their profit; secondly, to decrease their cost; lastly, to improve their usability."





                            share|improve this answer






























                              3














                              There are two usual alternatives to refer to the three items:




                              1. "not only...., but...and..."

                              2. "both...and...as well as..."


                              The first alternative - "not only..., but...and..." - has a limitation: it is basically intended to refer to two items, but is adapted to fit in three items by adding "and...". Moreover, "not only..." puts less emphasis on the first item.



                              The second alternative - "both...and...as well as..." - puts an emphasis on the last item.



                              Therefore, the best way to refer to three items is to use "...: firstly...; secondly...; lastly...". In the instant case, the sentence could be written as follows:



                              "There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites: firstly, to improve their profit; secondly, to decrease their cost; lastly, to improve their usability."





                              share|improve this answer




























                                3












                                3








                                3







                                There are two usual alternatives to refer to the three items:




                                1. "not only...., but...and..."

                                2. "both...and...as well as..."


                                The first alternative - "not only..., but...and..." - has a limitation: it is basically intended to refer to two items, but is adapted to fit in three items by adding "and...". Moreover, "not only..." puts less emphasis on the first item.



                                The second alternative - "both...and...as well as..." - puts an emphasis on the last item.



                                Therefore, the best way to refer to three items is to use "...: firstly...; secondly...; lastly...". In the instant case, the sentence could be written as follows:



                                "There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites: firstly, to improve their profit; secondly, to decrease their cost; lastly, to improve their usability."





                                share|improve this answer















                                There are two usual alternatives to refer to the three items:




                                1. "not only...., but...and..."

                                2. "both...and...as well as..."


                                The first alternative - "not only..., but...and..." - has a limitation: it is basically intended to refer to two items, but is adapted to fit in three items by adding "and...". Moreover, "not only..." puts less emphasis on the first item.



                                The second alternative - "both...and...as well as..." - puts an emphasis on the last item.



                                Therefore, the best way to refer to three items is to use "...: firstly...; secondly...; lastly...". In the instant case, the sentence could be written as follows:



                                "There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites: firstly, to improve their profit; secondly, to decrease their cost; lastly, to improve their usability."






                                share|improve this answer














                                share|improve this answer



                                share|improve this answer








                                edited Dec 11 '15 at 18:17

























                                answered Dec 11 '15 at 18:07









                                Dinesh Kumar GargDinesh Kumar Garg

                                1,61042350




                                1,61042350























                                    2














                                    Logically, you don't have "several" recommendations, but "three".




                                    There are three recommendations I have to further improve the sites - to improve their profit, decrease their cost and improve their usability.




                                    Cheers






                                    share|improve this answer



















                                    • 2





                                      No, improving profit is probably not a recommendation, but a supposed advantage of their unspecified (and not numbered) recommendations. Otherwise, that would be akin to proposing as a business idea: "Let's earn more money!"… ;)

                                      – Aaron Thoma
                                      Apr 6 '15 at 5:56
















                                    2














                                    Logically, you don't have "several" recommendations, but "three".




                                    There are three recommendations I have to further improve the sites - to improve their profit, decrease their cost and improve their usability.




                                    Cheers






                                    share|improve this answer



















                                    • 2





                                      No, improving profit is probably not a recommendation, but a supposed advantage of their unspecified (and not numbered) recommendations. Otherwise, that would be akin to proposing as a business idea: "Let's earn more money!"… ;)

                                      – Aaron Thoma
                                      Apr 6 '15 at 5:56














                                    2












                                    2








                                    2







                                    Logically, you don't have "several" recommendations, but "three".




                                    There are three recommendations I have to further improve the sites - to improve their profit, decrease their cost and improve their usability.




                                    Cheers






                                    share|improve this answer













                                    Logically, you don't have "several" recommendations, but "three".




                                    There are three recommendations I have to further improve the sites - to improve their profit, decrease their cost and improve their usability.




                                    Cheers







                                    share|improve this answer












                                    share|improve this answer



                                    share|improve this answer










                                    answered Jul 31 '14 at 23:14









                                    RenlabRenlab

                                    211




                                    211








                                    • 2





                                      No, improving profit is probably not a recommendation, but a supposed advantage of their unspecified (and not numbered) recommendations. Otherwise, that would be akin to proposing as a business idea: "Let's earn more money!"… ;)

                                      – Aaron Thoma
                                      Apr 6 '15 at 5:56














                                    • 2





                                      No, improving profit is probably not a recommendation, but a supposed advantage of their unspecified (and not numbered) recommendations. Otherwise, that would be akin to proposing as a business idea: "Let's earn more money!"… ;)

                                      – Aaron Thoma
                                      Apr 6 '15 at 5:56








                                    2




                                    2





                                    No, improving profit is probably not a recommendation, but a supposed advantage of their unspecified (and not numbered) recommendations. Otherwise, that would be akin to proposing as a business idea: "Let's earn more money!"… ;)

                                    – Aaron Thoma
                                    Apr 6 '15 at 5:56





                                    No, improving profit is probably not a recommendation, but a supposed advantage of their unspecified (and not numbered) recommendations. Otherwise, that would be akin to proposing as a business idea: "Let's earn more money!"… ;)

                                    – Aaron Thoma
                                    Apr 6 '15 at 5:56











                                    0














                                    Consider triad




                                    A grouping of three.




                                    https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/triad






                                    share|improve this answer




























                                      0














                                      Consider triad




                                      A grouping of three.




                                      https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/triad






                                      share|improve this answer


























                                        0












                                        0








                                        0







                                        Consider triad




                                        A grouping of three.




                                        https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/triad






                                        share|improve this answer













                                        Consider triad




                                        A grouping of three.




                                        https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/triad







                                        share|improve this answer












                                        share|improve this answer



                                        share|improve this answer










                                        answered Feb 2 '16 at 19:32









                                        271271

                                        3703716




                                        3703716























                                            0














                                            I ran into a somewhat similar situation recently where I was tempted to use "both" in reference to three items, as in:




                                            I did see a notable increase in my approach frequency when placed into a rare situation in my city where there was both high traffic overall, a high fraction of the target demographic, and conditions favourable to approaching.




                                            For this case, I found that "together" did the trick nicely:




                                            I did see a notable increase in my approach frequency when placed into a rare situation in my city where there was together high traffic overall, a high fraction of the target demographic, and conditions favourable to approaching.




                                            This doesn't work quite as nicely in your particular example, but I thought I'd mention it since it works well in some cases.



                                            It does work for your example also, just not quite as nicely:




                                            There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites — together to improve their profit, decrease their cost and improve their usability.




                                            However, for your example, some of the other suggestions, such as simply removing the conjunction altogether, are probably just as well. "Together" was more crucial to my example because the simultaneity of the factors was more significant to the meaning of the sentence.






                                            share|improve this answer




























                                              0














                                              I ran into a somewhat similar situation recently where I was tempted to use "both" in reference to three items, as in:




                                              I did see a notable increase in my approach frequency when placed into a rare situation in my city where there was both high traffic overall, a high fraction of the target demographic, and conditions favourable to approaching.




                                              For this case, I found that "together" did the trick nicely:




                                              I did see a notable increase in my approach frequency when placed into a rare situation in my city where there was together high traffic overall, a high fraction of the target demographic, and conditions favourable to approaching.




                                              This doesn't work quite as nicely in your particular example, but I thought I'd mention it since it works well in some cases.



                                              It does work for your example also, just not quite as nicely:




                                              There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites — together to improve their profit, decrease their cost and improve their usability.




                                              However, for your example, some of the other suggestions, such as simply removing the conjunction altogether, are probably just as well. "Together" was more crucial to my example because the simultaneity of the factors was more significant to the meaning of the sentence.






                                              share|improve this answer


























                                                0












                                                0








                                                0







                                                I ran into a somewhat similar situation recently where I was tempted to use "both" in reference to three items, as in:




                                                I did see a notable increase in my approach frequency when placed into a rare situation in my city where there was both high traffic overall, a high fraction of the target demographic, and conditions favourable to approaching.




                                                For this case, I found that "together" did the trick nicely:




                                                I did see a notable increase in my approach frequency when placed into a rare situation in my city where there was together high traffic overall, a high fraction of the target demographic, and conditions favourable to approaching.




                                                This doesn't work quite as nicely in your particular example, but I thought I'd mention it since it works well in some cases.



                                                It does work for your example also, just not quite as nicely:




                                                There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites — together to improve their profit, decrease their cost and improve their usability.




                                                However, for your example, some of the other suggestions, such as simply removing the conjunction altogether, are probably just as well. "Together" was more crucial to my example because the simultaneity of the factors was more significant to the meaning of the sentence.






                                                share|improve this answer













                                                I ran into a somewhat similar situation recently where I was tempted to use "both" in reference to three items, as in:




                                                I did see a notable increase in my approach frequency when placed into a rare situation in my city where there was both high traffic overall, a high fraction of the target demographic, and conditions favourable to approaching.




                                                For this case, I found that "together" did the trick nicely:




                                                I did see a notable increase in my approach frequency when placed into a rare situation in my city where there was together high traffic overall, a high fraction of the target demographic, and conditions favourable to approaching.




                                                This doesn't work quite as nicely in your particular example, but I thought I'd mention it since it works well in some cases.



                                                It does work for your example also, just not quite as nicely:




                                                There are several recommendations I have to further improve the sites — together to improve their profit, decrease their cost and improve their usability.




                                                However, for your example, some of the other suggestions, such as simply removing the conjunction altogether, are probably just as well. "Together" was more crucial to my example because the simultaneity of the factors was more significant to the meaning of the sentence.







                                                share|improve this answer












                                                share|improve this answer



                                                share|improve this answer










                                                answered 59 mins ago









                                                KevinKevin

                                                1143




                                                1143

















                                                    protected by tchrist Aug 13 '14 at 14:39



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