Difference between “thrown under a bus” and “thrown to the wolves”?












2















Is there any difference between the phrases "thrown under a bus" and "thrown to the wolves"? As far as I can tell they mean basically the same thing, but the "bus" phrases came into existence after the "wolves" phrase was already fully established, so maybe there's some connotations I'm missing.










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  • Related: english.stackexchange.com/questions/30698/…

    – user66974
    Jul 13 '16 at 5:52











  • Being "thrown under the bus" implies being made a scapegoat.

    – Hot Licks
    Jul 13 '16 at 12:15
















2















Is there any difference between the phrases "thrown under a bus" and "thrown to the wolves"? As far as I can tell they mean basically the same thing, but the "bus" phrases came into existence after the "wolves" phrase was already fully established, so maybe there's some connotations I'm missing.










share|improve this question























  • Related: english.stackexchange.com/questions/30698/…

    – user66974
    Jul 13 '16 at 5:52











  • Being "thrown under the bus" implies being made a scapegoat.

    – Hot Licks
    Jul 13 '16 at 12:15














2












2








2








Is there any difference between the phrases "thrown under a bus" and "thrown to the wolves"? As far as I can tell they mean basically the same thing, but the "bus" phrases came into existence after the "wolves" phrase was already fully established, so maybe there's some connotations I'm missing.










share|improve this question














Is there any difference between the phrases "thrown under a bus" and "thrown to the wolves"? As far as I can tell they mean basically the same thing, but the "bus" phrases came into existence after the "wolves" phrase was already fully established, so maybe there's some connotations I'm missing.







differences colloquialisms






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asked Jul 13 '16 at 5:40









Matthew ClineMatthew Cline

58138




58138













  • Related: english.stackexchange.com/questions/30698/…

    – user66974
    Jul 13 '16 at 5:52











  • Being "thrown under the bus" implies being made a scapegoat.

    – Hot Licks
    Jul 13 '16 at 12:15



















  • Related: english.stackexchange.com/questions/30698/…

    – user66974
    Jul 13 '16 at 5:52











  • Being "thrown under the bus" implies being made a scapegoat.

    – Hot Licks
    Jul 13 '16 at 12:15

















Related: english.stackexchange.com/questions/30698/…

– user66974
Jul 13 '16 at 5:52





Related: english.stackexchange.com/questions/30698/…

– user66974
Jul 13 '16 at 5:52













Being "thrown under the bus" implies being made a scapegoat.

– Hot Licks
Jul 13 '16 at 12:15





Being "thrown under the bus" implies being made a scapegoat.

– Hot Licks
Jul 13 '16 at 12:15










3 Answers
3






active

oldest

votes


















3














They actually convey different meanings and are used in different contexts:



Throw under the bus:





  • The clichéd expression throw under the bus means, roughly, (1) to betray, (2) to callously dispose of, or (3) to pass blame onto another for selfish reasons. It has been ubiquitous in the U.S. media for several years. While the expression might work in rare circumstances, it reeks of hyperbole and introduces violent imagery where it usually isn’t called for.


  • In our search for examples in the news, about half the instances of under the bus dealt with actual vehicular violence, which to us confirms that the expression is not just overextreme but insensitive. Granted, there are many common expressions that evoke violence (including the synonymous stab in the back), but this one is worse because it’s so ubiquitous.


  • If betray isn’t a good enough replacement for throw under the bus, consider double-cross, dupe, put one over, bamboozle, hang out to dry, or sell out. Some of these are themselves clichés, but at least they’re not widely overused at the moment.





(The Grammarist)



Throw to the wolves:






  • Also, throw to the dogs or lions. Send to a terrible fate; sacrifice someone, especially so as to save oneself. For example, Leaving him with hostile reporters was throwing him to the wolves, or If Bob doesn't perform as they expect, they'll throw him to the lions. All three hyperbolic terms allude to the ravenous appetite of these animals, which presumably will devour the victim. The first term comes from Aesop's fable about a nurse who threatens to throw her charge to the wolves if the child does not behave. [First half of 1900s ]




(Dictionary.com)






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  • I'd add scapegoating to the connotation of throw under the bus. Or maybe not quite scapegoating but saving oneself by substituting another victim. There can be the notion that, though the person thrown might have been close to the thrower, the thrower didn't hesitate to get out of the way by pushing the throwee in the way of the bus.

    – Drew
    Jul 17 '18 at 13:28



















1














Regarding the attribution of "Thrown to the wolves" to Aesop's fable, I would suggest that that does not capture the essence of the phrase.



Thrown to the wolves has always, to my mind, had the sense of sacrificing someone else to save oneself or to save others. i.e. pushing someone out of a lifeboat if there isn't enough room or water.



The attribution I've heard, which I'm going to pursue with a professor of Russian literature in my family, is that it comes from Russian literature where a peasant would be thrown from a troika when pursued by wolves, in order to satisfy or delay the wolves.






share|improve this answer































    0














    My understanding is:

    I've seen "Thrown under the bus" used as a person being tattled upon to authority. It may be just or unjust, but they are exposed for a real or false wrongdoing. The motive may be the whistle-blower out for gain at the other's expense or to simply prevent the victim of this tactic from doing any more damage to the shared situation, frequently in a workplace or school.

    I've primarily seen "Thrown to the wolves" as meaning simply exposing a person to mob mentality or being abandoned in an environment where they are helpless and likely to fall victim to whatever hazards will ultimately end their endeavors unsuccessfully.

    The key difference here is that "the bus" indicates one singular source of authority being the hazard, whereas "the wolves" indicates a source of danger that is at ground-level, similar in class or social standing to the victim -- basically "the masses" or the environment/nature itself, and plural in nature.






    share|improve this answer








    New contributor




    Jeremy D. is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
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      3 Answers
      3






      active

      oldest

      votes








      3 Answers
      3






      active

      oldest

      votes









      active

      oldest

      votes






      active

      oldest

      votes









      3














      They actually convey different meanings and are used in different contexts:



      Throw under the bus:





      • The clichéd expression throw under the bus means, roughly, (1) to betray, (2) to callously dispose of, or (3) to pass blame onto another for selfish reasons. It has been ubiquitous in the U.S. media for several years. While the expression might work in rare circumstances, it reeks of hyperbole and introduces violent imagery where it usually isn’t called for.


      • In our search for examples in the news, about half the instances of under the bus dealt with actual vehicular violence, which to us confirms that the expression is not just overextreme but insensitive. Granted, there are many common expressions that evoke violence (including the synonymous stab in the back), but this one is worse because it’s so ubiquitous.


      • If betray isn’t a good enough replacement for throw under the bus, consider double-cross, dupe, put one over, bamboozle, hang out to dry, or sell out. Some of these are themselves clichés, but at least they’re not widely overused at the moment.





      (The Grammarist)



      Throw to the wolves:






      • Also, throw to the dogs or lions. Send to a terrible fate; sacrifice someone, especially so as to save oneself. For example, Leaving him with hostile reporters was throwing him to the wolves, or If Bob doesn't perform as they expect, they'll throw him to the lions. All three hyperbolic terms allude to the ravenous appetite of these animals, which presumably will devour the victim. The first term comes from Aesop's fable about a nurse who threatens to throw her charge to the wolves if the child does not behave. [First half of 1900s ]




      (Dictionary.com)






      share|improve this answer


























      • I'd add scapegoating to the connotation of throw under the bus. Or maybe not quite scapegoating but saving oneself by substituting another victim. There can be the notion that, though the person thrown might have been close to the thrower, the thrower didn't hesitate to get out of the way by pushing the throwee in the way of the bus.

        – Drew
        Jul 17 '18 at 13:28
















      3














      They actually convey different meanings and are used in different contexts:



      Throw under the bus:





      • The clichéd expression throw under the bus means, roughly, (1) to betray, (2) to callously dispose of, or (3) to pass blame onto another for selfish reasons. It has been ubiquitous in the U.S. media for several years. While the expression might work in rare circumstances, it reeks of hyperbole and introduces violent imagery where it usually isn’t called for.


      • In our search for examples in the news, about half the instances of under the bus dealt with actual vehicular violence, which to us confirms that the expression is not just overextreme but insensitive. Granted, there are many common expressions that evoke violence (including the synonymous stab in the back), but this one is worse because it’s so ubiquitous.


      • If betray isn’t a good enough replacement for throw under the bus, consider double-cross, dupe, put one over, bamboozle, hang out to dry, or sell out. Some of these are themselves clichés, but at least they’re not widely overused at the moment.





      (The Grammarist)



      Throw to the wolves:






      • Also, throw to the dogs or lions. Send to a terrible fate; sacrifice someone, especially so as to save oneself. For example, Leaving him with hostile reporters was throwing him to the wolves, or If Bob doesn't perform as they expect, they'll throw him to the lions. All three hyperbolic terms allude to the ravenous appetite of these animals, which presumably will devour the victim. The first term comes from Aesop's fable about a nurse who threatens to throw her charge to the wolves if the child does not behave. [First half of 1900s ]




      (Dictionary.com)






      share|improve this answer


























      • I'd add scapegoating to the connotation of throw under the bus. Or maybe not quite scapegoating but saving oneself by substituting another victim. There can be the notion that, though the person thrown might have been close to the thrower, the thrower didn't hesitate to get out of the way by pushing the throwee in the way of the bus.

        – Drew
        Jul 17 '18 at 13:28














      3












      3








      3







      They actually convey different meanings and are used in different contexts:



      Throw under the bus:





      • The clichéd expression throw under the bus means, roughly, (1) to betray, (2) to callously dispose of, or (3) to pass blame onto another for selfish reasons. It has been ubiquitous in the U.S. media for several years. While the expression might work in rare circumstances, it reeks of hyperbole and introduces violent imagery where it usually isn’t called for.


      • In our search for examples in the news, about half the instances of under the bus dealt with actual vehicular violence, which to us confirms that the expression is not just overextreme but insensitive. Granted, there are many common expressions that evoke violence (including the synonymous stab in the back), but this one is worse because it’s so ubiquitous.


      • If betray isn’t a good enough replacement for throw under the bus, consider double-cross, dupe, put one over, bamboozle, hang out to dry, or sell out. Some of these are themselves clichés, but at least they’re not widely overused at the moment.





      (The Grammarist)



      Throw to the wolves:






      • Also, throw to the dogs or lions. Send to a terrible fate; sacrifice someone, especially so as to save oneself. For example, Leaving him with hostile reporters was throwing him to the wolves, or If Bob doesn't perform as they expect, they'll throw him to the lions. All three hyperbolic terms allude to the ravenous appetite of these animals, which presumably will devour the victim. The first term comes from Aesop's fable about a nurse who threatens to throw her charge to the wolves if the child does not behave. [First half of 1900s ]




      (Dictionary.com)






      share|improve this answer















      They actually convey different meanings and are used in different contexts:



      Throw under the bus:





      • The clichéd expression throw under the bus means, roughly, (1) to betray, (2) to callously dispose of, or (3) to pass blame onto another for selfish reasons. It has been ubiquitous in the U.S. media for several years. While the expression might work in rare circumstances, it reeks of hyperbole and introduces violent imagery where it usually isn’t called for.


      • In our search for examples in the news, about half the instances of under the bus dealt with actual vehicular violence, which to us confirms that the expression is not just overextreme but insensitive. Granted, there are many common expressions that evoke violence (including the synonymous stab in the back), but this one is worse because it’s so ubiquitous.


      • If betray isn’t a good enough replacement for throw under the bus, consider double-cross, dupe, put one over, bamboozle, hang out to dry, or sell out. Some of these are themselves clichés, but at least they’re not widely overused at the moment.





      (The Grammarist)



      Throw to the wolves:






      • Also, throw to the dogs or lions. Send to a terrible fate; sacrifice someone, especially so as to save oneself. For example, Leaving him with hostile reporters was throwing him to the wolves, or If Bob doesn't perform as they expect, they'll throw him to the lions. All three hyperbolic terms allude to the ravenous appetite of these animals, which presumably will devour the victim. The first term comes from Aesop's fable about a nurse who threatens to throw her charge to the wolves if the child does not behave. [First half of 1900s ]




      (Dictionary.com)







      share|improve this answer














      share|improve this answer



      share|improve this answer








      edited Jul 13 '16 at 6:05

























      answered Jul 13 '16 at 5:57







      user66974




















      • I'd add scapegoating to the connotation of throw under the bus. Or maybe not quite scapegoating but saving oneself by substituting another victim. There can be the notion that, though the person thrown might have been close to the thrower, the thrower didn't hesitate to get out of the way by pushing the throwee in the way of the bus.

        – Drew
        Jul 17 '18 at 13:28



















      • I'd add scapegoating to the connotation of throw under the bus. Or maybe not quite scapegoating but saving oneself by substituting another victim. There can be the notion that, though the person thrown might have been close to the thrower, the thrower didn't hesitate to get out of the way by pushing the throwee in the way of the bus.

        – Drew
        Jul 17 '18 at 13:28

















      I'd add scapegoating to the connotation of throw under the bus. Or maybe not quite scapegoating but saving oneself by substituting another victim. There can be the notion that, though the person thrown might have been close to the thrower, the thrower didn't hesitate to get out of the way by pushing the throwee in the way of the bus.

      – Drew
      Jul 17 '18 at 13:28





      I'd add scapegoating to the connotation of throw under the bus. Or maybe not quite scapegoating but saving oneself by substituting another victim. There can be the notion that, though the person thrown might have been close to the thrower, the thrower didn't hesitate to get out of the way by pushing the throwee in the way of the bus.

      – Drew
      Jul 17 '18 at 13:28













      1














      Regarding the attribution of "Thrown to the wolves" to Aesop's fable, I would suggest that that does not capture the essence of the phrase.



      Thrown to the wolves has always, to my mind, had the sense of sacrificing someone else to save oneself or to save others. i.e. pushing someone out of a lifeboat if there isn't enough room or water.



      The attribution I've heard, which I'm going to pursue with a professor of Russian literature in my family, is that it comes from Russian literature where a peasant would be thrown from a troika when pursued by wolves, in order to satisfy or delay the wolves.






      share|improve this answer




























        1














        Regarding the attribution of "Thrown to the wolves" to Aesop's fable, I would suggest that that does not capture the essence of the phrase.



        Thrown to the wolves has always, to my mind, had the sense of sacrificing someone else to save oneself or to save others. i.e. pushing someone out of a lifeboat if there isn't enough room or water.



        The attribution I've heard, which I'm going to pursue with a professor of Russian literature in my family, is that it comes from Russian literature where a peasant would be thrown from a troika when pursued by wolves, in order to satisfy or delay the wolves.






        share|improve this answer


























          1












          1








          1







          Regarding the attribution of "Thrown to the wolves" to Aesop's fable, I would suggest that that does not capture the essence of the phrase.



          Thrown to the wolves has always, to my mind, had the sense of sacrificing someone else to save oneself or to save others. i.e. pushing someone out of a lifeboat if there isn't enough room or water.



          The attribution I've heard, which I'm going to pursue with a professor of Russian literature in my family, is that it comes from Russian literature where a peasant would be thrown from a troika when pursued by wolves, in order to satisfy or delay the wolves.






          share|improve this answer













          Regarding the attribution of "Thrown to the wolves" to Aesop's fable, I would suggest that that does not capture the essence of the phrase.



          Thrown to the wolves has always, to my mind, had the sense of sacrificing someone else to save oneself or to save others. i.e. pushing someone out of a lifeboat if there isn't enough room or water.



          The attribution I've heard, which I'm going to pursue with a professor of Russian literature in my family, is that it comes from Russian literature where a peasant would be thrown from a troika when pursued by wolves, in order to satisfy or delay the wolves.







          share|improve this answer












          share|improve this answer



          share|improve this answer










          answered Jul 17 '18 at 11:35









          Bill McCaslanBill McCaslan

          111




          111























              0














              My understanding is:

              I've seen "Thrown under the bus" used as a person being tattled upon to authority. It may be just or unjust, but they are exposed for a real or false wrongdoing. The motive may be the whistle-blower out for gain at the other's expense or to simply prevent the victim of this tactic from doing any more damage to the shared situation, frequently in a workplace or school.

              I've primarily seen "Thrown to the wolves" as meaning simply exposing a person to mob mentality or being abandoned in an environment where they are helpless and likely to fall victim to whatever hazards will ultimately end their endeavors unsuccessfully.

              The key difference here is that "the bus" indicates one singular source of authority being the hazard, whereas "the wolves" indicates a source of danger that is at ground-level, similar in class or social standing to the victim -- basically "the masses" or the environment/nature itself, and plural in nature.






              share|improve this answer








              New contributor




              Jeremy D. is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
              Check out our Code of Conduct.

























                0














                My understanding is:

                I've seen "Thrown under the bus" used as a person being tattled upon to authority. It may be just or unjust, but they are exposed for a real or false wrongdoing. The motive may be the whistle-blower out for gain at the other's expense or to simply prevent the victim of this tactic from doing any more damage to the shared situation, frequently in a workplace or school.

                I've primarily seen "Thrown to the wolves" as meaning simply exposing a person to mob mentality or being abandoned in an environment where they are helpless and likely to fall victim to whatever hazards will ultimately end their endeavors unsuccessfully.

                The key difference here is that "the bus" indicates one singular source of authority being the hazard, whereas "the wolves" indicates a source of danger that is at ground-level, similar in class or social standing to the victim -- basically "the masses" or the environment/nature itself, and plural in nature.






                share|improve this answer








                New contributor




                Jeremy D. is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                Check out our Code of Conduct.























                  0












                  0








                  0







                  My understanding is:

                  I've seen "Thrown under the bus" used as a person being tattled upon to authority. It may be just or unjust, but they are exposed for a real or false wrongdoing. The motive may be the whistle-blower out for gain at the other's expense or to simply prevent the victim of this tactic from doing any more damage to the shared situation, frequently in a workplace or school.

                  I've primarily seen "Thrown to the wolves" as meaning simply exposing a person to mob mentality or being abandoned in an environment where they are helpless and likely to fall victim to whatever hazards will ultimately end their endeavors unsuccessfully.

                  The key difference here is that "the bus" indicates one singular source of authority being the hazard, whereas "the wolves" indicates a source of danger that is at ground-level, similar in class or social standing to the victim -- basically "the masses" or the environment/nature itself, and plural in nature.






                  share|improve this answer








                  New contributor




                  Jeremy D. is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                  Check out our Code of Conduct.










                  My understanding is:

                  I've seen "Thrown under the bus" used as a person being tattled upon to authority. It may be just or unjust, but they are exposed for a real or false wrongdoing. The motive may be the whistle-blower out for gain at the other's expense or to simply prevent the victim of this tactic from doing any more damage to the shared situation, frequently in a workplace or school.

                  I've primarily seen "Thrown to the wolves" as meaning simply exposing a person to mob mentality or being abandoned in an environment where they are helpless and likely to fall victim to whatever hazards will ultimately end their endeavors unsuccessfully.

                  The key difference here is that "the bus" indicates one singular source of authority being the hazard, whereas "the wolves" indicates a source of danger that is at ground-level, similar in class or social standing to the victim -- basically "the masses" or the environment/nature itself, and plural in nature.







                  share|improve this answer








                  New contributor




                  Jeremy D. is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                  Check out our Code of Conduct.









                  share|improve this answer



                  share|improve this answer






                  New contributor




                  Jeremy D. is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                  Check out our Code of Conduct.









                  answered 11 mins ago









                  Jeremy D.Jeremy D.

                  1




                  1




                  New contributor




                  Jeremy D. is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                  Check out our Code of Conduct.





                  New contributor





                  Jeremy D. is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                  Check out our Code of Conduct.






                  Jeremy D. is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                  Check out our Code of Conduct.






























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